The Natural Philosopher writes:

> kmbfhaya wrote:
>> "Ignoramus17370" wrote in
>> message news:d5qdnWOAYaiNUXDanZ2dnUVZ_qjinZ2d@giganews.com ...
>>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/macworld/200...insharpdecline
>>>
>>> Microsoft's brand power has been in sharp decline over the past four
>>> years, an indication the company is losing credibility and mindshare
>>> with U.S. business users, according to a recent study by market
>>> research firm CoreBrand.
>>> ADVERTISEMENT
>>>
>>> According to the CoreBrand Power 100 2007 study, which polled about
>>> 12,000 U.S. business decision-makers, Microsoft dropped from number 12
>>> in the ranking of the most powerful U.S. company brands in 2004 to
>>> number 59 last year. In 1996, the company ranked number 1 in brand
>>> power among 1,200 top companies in about 50 industries, said James
>>> Gregory, CEO of CoreBrand.
>>>
>>> CoreBrand measures brand power using four criteria. It first rates the
>>> familiarity of a company's brand. Once a company has a certain level
>>> of familiarity, they are ranked according to three "attributes of
>>> favorability": overall reputation, perception of management and
>>> investment potential, Gregory said. While Microsoft's brand is still
>>> eminently recognizable, the company is declining in all three
>>> favorable attributes, he said.
>>>
>>> Gregory said that a decline in and of itself is not indicative that a
>>> company is losing its mindshare or reputation among
>>> customers. However, what's significant in Microsoft's case is that the
>>> decline has been consistent over a number of years, and has plunged
>>> dramatically in a brief time.
>>>
>>> "When you see something decline with increasing velocity, it's a
>>> concern," he said.
>>>
>>> Among its peers in the category of Computers, Peripherals and Computer
>>> Software, Microsoft is second to IBM in brand power, with Toshiba a
>>> close third, Gregory said. If Microsoft's downward trend continues,
>>> Toshiba could pass it in brand power next year, he said.
>>>
>>> Gregory could only speculate as to why Microsoft's reputation has been
>>> declining, since his firm does not ask people that specific
>>> question. He said the "underwhelming" response to Windows Vista might
>>> be one reason, and Apple's clever "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" advertising
>>> campaign -- which paints Windows in an unfavorable light -- may be
>>> another.
>>>
>>> IBM suffered a "much faster and more severe" decline in brand power in
>>> the early 1990s, Gregory said, and it took them 10 years to rebuild
>>> the brand's reputation. To stage a similar turnaround, Microsoft must
>>> have a clearer vision of the direction in which the company is headed
>>> and put forth leaders that people can trust to articulate that vision,
>>> he said.
>>>
>>> Microsoft, which has been diversifying its business beyond packaged
>>> software in the past several years, has struggled to articulate how
>>> the many facets of its business -- software, entertainment and online
>>> among them -- show a cohesive business plan. The company has been
>>> trying to clarify at least one of those strategies -- its online
>>> advertising business -- with new services and a bid to purchase
>>> Yahoo. However, Gregory suggested it may take more than that to raise
>>> the perception of its brand.
>>
>> Oh yes, Microsoft is doing so terribly. That's why Linux has a whopping .67
>> percent market share. Try thinking for yourself for once you
>> ignoramus
>>
>>
>
> Linux has a zero market share, since its never sold.

Well there's another lie.

Nearly all the major distributors sell support licenses for a start.

--
< asuffield> a workstation is anything you can stick on somebodies desk
and con them into using
-- in #debian-devel

In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Hadron

wrote
on Mon, 31 Mar 2008 20:23:41 +0200
:
> The Natural Philosopher writes:
>
>> kmbfhaya wrote:
>>> "Ignoramus17370" wrote in
>>> message news:d5qdnWOAYaiNUXDanZ2dnUVZ_qjinZ2d@giganews.com ...
>>>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/macworld/200...insharpdecline
>>>>
>>>> Microsoft's brand power has been in sharp decline over the past four
>>>> years, an indication the company is losing credibility and mindshare
>>>> with U.S. business users, according to a recent study by market
>>>> research firm CoreBrand.
>>>> ADVERTISEMENT
>>>>
>>>> According to the CoreBrand Power 100 2007 study, which polled about
>>>> 12,000 U.S. business decision-makers, Microsoft dropped from number 12
>>>> in the ranking of the most powerful U.S. company brands in 2004 to
>>>> number 59 last year. In 1996, the company ranked number 1 in brand
>>>> power among 1,200 top companies in about 50 industries, said James
>>>> Gregory, CEO of CoreBrand.
>>>>
>>>> CoreBrand measures brand power using four criteria. It first rates the
>>>> familiarity of a company's brand. Once a company has a certain level
>>>> of familiarity, they are ranked according to three "attributes of
>>>> favorability": overall reputation, perception of management and
>>>> investment potential, Gregory said. While Microsoft's brand is still
>>>> eminently recognizable, the company is declining in all three
>>>> favorable attributes, he said.
>>>>
>>>> Gregory said that a decline in and of itself is not indicative that a
>>>> company is losing its mindshare or reputation among
>>>> customers. However, what's significant in Microsoft's case is that the
>>>> decline has been consistent over a number of years, and has plunged
>>>> dramatically in a brief time.
>>>>
>>>> "When you see something decline with increasing velocity, it's a
>>>> concern," he said.
>>>>
>>>> Among its peers in the category of Computers, Peripherals and Computer
>>>> Software, Microsoft is second to IBM in brand power, with Toshiba a
>>>> close third, Gregory said. If Microsoft's downward trend continues,
>>>> Toshiba could pass it in brand power next year, he said.
>>>>
>>>> Gregory could only speculate as to why Microsoft's reputation has been
>>>> declining, since his firm does not ask people that specific
>>>> question. He said the "underwhelming" response to Windows Vista might
>>>> be one reason, and Apple's clever "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" advertising
>>>> campaign -- which paints Windows in an unfavorable light -- may be
>>>> another.
>>>>
>>>> IBM suffered a "much faster and more severe" decline in brand power in
>>>> the early 1990s, Gregory said, and it took them 10 years to rebuild
>>>> the brand's reputation. To stage a similar turnaround, Microsoft must
>>>> have a clearer vision of the direction in which the company is headed
>>>> and put forth leaders that people can trust to articulate that vision,
>>>> he said.
>>>>
>>>> Microsoft, which has been diversifying its business beyond packaged
>>>> software in the past several years, has struggled to articulate how
>>>> the many facets of its business -- software, entertainment and online
>>>> among them -- show a cohesive business plan. The company has been
>>>> trying to clarify at least one of those strategies -- its online
>>>> advertising business -- with new services and a bid to purchase
>>>> Yahoo. However, Gregory suggested it may take more than that to raise
>>>> the perception of its brand.
>>>
>>> Oh yes, Microsoft is doing so terribly. That's why Linux has a
>>> whopping .67 percent market share. Try thinking for yourself
>>> for once you ignoramus
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Linux has a zero market share, since its never sold.
>
> Well there's another lie.
>
> Nearly all the major distributors sell support licenses for a start.
>

It gets complicated, but "The Natural Philosopher" is
essentially correct: Linux is never sold. It's given
away, with the monetary compensation for such companies
as Red Hat and Novell being used for support licenses.

It just looks an awful lot like other software sales. ;-)

However, this does not translate into zero market share,
which more properly would be "zero desktop share" (since
that's the subarea of interest here) anyway, but the
details get very squirrely as that one disc given away by
RedHat can be installed on as many boxes as one likes, and
the disc duplicated as many times as one likes, although if
any of the boxes not supported by Red Hat has a problem,
Red Hat is not obligated to provide support in any way,
shape, or form, and the disc duplicates should not use
the term "Red Hat" because of trademark infringment -- hence
terms such as "Pink Tie" and "Fedora".

It's further complicated by multiboots and virtual machines.

So how many instances of Linux are out there, really?
We may never know. What we *do* know is RedHat's revenue
or Novell's revenue versus Microsoft's, and that, at least,
is simple enough:

Market Cap Revenue(ttm) Income(ttm)
MSFT $264B $57.90B $16.96B
RHT $3.57B $0.49265B $0.07515B
NOVL $2.20B $0.94504B $0.000582B

--
#191, ewill3@earthlink.net
Linux. Because vaporware only goes so far.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

>Linux has a zero market share, since its never sold.

Idiot.

*plonk*

Hadron wrote:

> The Natural Philosopher writes:
>
>> kmbfhaya wrote:
>>> "Ignoramus17370" wrote in
>>> message news:d5qdnWOAYaiNUXDanZ2dnUVZ_qjinZ2d@giganews.com ...
>>>>
http://news.yahoo.com/s/macworld/200...insharpdecline
>>>>
>>>> Microsoft's brand power has been in sharp decline over the past four
>>>> years, an indication the company is losing credibility and mindshare
>>>> with U.S. business users, according to a recent study by market
>>>> research firm CoreBrand.
>>>> ADVERTISEMENT
>>>>
>>>> According to the CoreBrand Power 100 2007 study, which polled about
>>>> 12,000 U.S. business decision-makers, Microsoft dropped from number 12
>>>> in the ranking of the most powerful U.S. company brands in 2004 to
>>>> number 59 last year. In 1996, the company ranked number 1 in brand
>>>> power among 1,200 top companies in about 50 industries, said James
>>>> Gregory, CEO of CoreBrand.
>>>>
>>>> CoreBrand measures brand power using four criteria. It first rates the
>>>> familiarity of a company's brand. Once a company has a certain level
>>>> of familiarity, they are ranked according to three "attributes of
>>>> favorability": overall reputation, perception of management and
>>>> investment potential, Gregory said. While Microsoft's brand is still
>>>> eminently recognizable, the company is declining in all three
>>>> favorable attributes, he said.
>>>>
>>>> Gregory said that a decline in and of itself is not indicative that a
>>>> company is losing its mindshare or reputation among
>>>> customers. However, what's significant in Microsoft's case is that the
>>>> decline has been consistent over a number of years, and has plunged
>>>> dramatically in a brief time.
>>>>
>>>> "When you see something decline with increasing velocity, it's a
>>>> concern," he said.
>>>>
>>>> Among its peers in the category of Computers, Peripherals and Computer
>>>> Software, Microsoft is second to IBM in brand power, with Toshiba a
>>>> close third, Gregory said. If Microsoft's downward trend continues,
>>>> Toshiba could pass it in brand power next year, he said.
>>>>
>>>> Gregory could only speculate as to why Microsoft's reputation has been
>>>> declining, since his firm does not ask people that specific
>>>> question. He said the "underwhelming" response to Windows Vista might
>>>> be one reason, and Apple's clever "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" advertising
>>>> campaign -- which paints Windows in an unfavorable light -- may be
>>>> another.
>>>>
>>>> IBM suffered a "much faster and more severe" decline in brand power in
>>>> the early 1990s, Gregory said, and it took them 10 years to rebuild
>>>> the brand's reputation. To stage a similar turnaround, Microsoft must
>>>> have a clearer vision of the direction in which the company is headed
>>>> and put forth leaders that people can trust to articulate that vision,
>>>> he said.
>>>>
>>>> Microsoft, which has been diversifying its business beyond packaged
>>>> software in the past several years, has struggled to articulate how
>>>> the many facets of its business -- software, entertainment and online
>>>> among them -- show a cohesive business plan. The company has been
>>>> trying to clarify at least one of those strategies -- its online
>>>> advertising business -- with new services and a bid to purchase
>>>> Yahoo. However, Gregory suggested it may take more than that to raise
>>>> the perception of its brand.
>>>
>>> Oh yes, Microsoft is doing so terribly. That's why Linux has a whopping
>>> .67 percent market share. Try thinking for yourself for once you
>>> ignoramus
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Linux has a zero market share, since its never sold.
>
> Well there's another lie.
>
> Nearly all the major distributors sell support licenses for a start.
>
Have you ever bought one? I highly doubt it. I doubt anyone around here has
bought a support license. We tend to roll our own.

Cheers.

--
The world can't afford the rich.

alt.os.linux.ubuntu - where the lunatic Hadron is a "Linux advocate"

Francis (Frank) adds a new "gadget" to his Vista box ...
Download it here: http://tinyurl.com/2hnof6

Moshe Goldfarb wrote:

> On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 14:16:56 GMT, Wes Groleau wrote:

>> Roy Schestowitz wrote:

>>> Microsoft will have to drop the "soft" from the brand and try to evolve with
>>> something like "Zune" (Oh lordy!).

>> M$ will never catch the iPod.

> And where are all these Linux based iPod-like devices we keep hearing
> about?

> The Linux loons keep telling us they are iPod killers....

> Where are they hiding?

Go to http://www.archos.com

I have the fourth and the fifth generation models. Better than any iPod.

On 2008-04-01, White Spirit wrote:
> Moshe Goldfarb wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 14:16:56 GMT, Wes Groleau wrote:
>
>>> Roy Schestowitz wrote:
>
>>>> Microsoft will have to drop the "soft" from the brand and try to evolve with
>>>> something like "Zune" (Oh lordy!).
>
>>> M$ will never catch the iPod.
>
>> And where are all these Linux based iPod-like devices we keep hearing
>> about?
>
>> The Linux loons keep telling us they are iPod killers....
>
>> Where are they hiding?
>
> Go to http://www.archos.com
>
> I have the fourth and the fifth generation models. Better than any iPod.

They could still use a bit of work on the interfaces but they
have the basic functionality down. The key value of an Archos is
that you don't need to convert your content. You don't have to
transform your video into something that will be acknowledged by
the "indian agents" on the Apple "reservation".

Video could shake things up. There's much more diversity in
terms of already existing content and it's much more time
consuming to convert.

--

Metallica is not worth the ruination of someone |||
who has pirated their music / | \


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notbob illuminated alt.os.linux.ubuntu by typing:
> On 2008-03-31, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> Linux has a zero market share, since its never sold.
>
> Not true. I pay for my Slackware. I don't have to, but I do. Same for
> other distros. RH and Suse and Slackware are usually on the shelf at Fry's
> and other retailers.

Being from the Uk, and having no digeridoo about who the hell "fry's
and other retailers" are...

How the hell to the developers of the distro gain from these twats
"selling" something that is freely available?

Or is it just a case of another business *taking* something and selling
it for profit?

Or is this one of those "shrinkwrap" distro's that charge 30p for the
box and the retailer sells it for £5?

*Kerrching*

--
Moog

"If this is gonna be that kinda party I'm gonna stick my dick in the
mashed potatoes"