Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux? - Linux

This is a discussion on Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux? - Linux ; http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/03/28...raid-of-linux/ I tend to view Linux as two different animals, rightly or wrongly. There's Linux for the desktop, like Ubuntu, Gentoo, Knoppix and whatever flavor-of-the-month distro gets mentioned on this week's Tekzilla. But really, with a 0.65 percent market share, ...

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  1. Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?



    http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/03/28...raid-of-linux/


    I tend to view Linux as two different animals, rightly or wrongly. There's
    Linux for the desktop, like Ubuntu, Gentoo, Knoppix and whatever
    flavor-of-the-month distro gets mentioned on this week's Tekzilla.

    But really, with a 0.65 percent market share, do you really think Microsoft
    is worried about losing out to Linux? Its biggest competitor is Mac OS X,
    and that's still only on 7.5 percent of all computers.

    Linux on the server, however, is a whole 'nother matter. A quick trip to
    microsoft.com offers a glimpse of how Redmond feels about the free as in
    freedom OS. There's all sorts of charts and graphs and mentions of total
    costs of ownership.

    But is that enough to call Microsoft "afraid" of Linux?

    So, should Microsoft be afraid of Linux? I really doubt it. I honestly can't
    see regular users switching away from Windows, pirated or otherwise, to
    Linux. On the server market, yes, there's a little more competition, but
    that just means Microsoft will have to actually try to innovate and
    convince its customers that a Windows license is worth their while.





    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


  2. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 21:28:28 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:

    > http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/03/28...x-2008-should-

    microsoft-be-afraid-of-linux/
    >
    >
    > I tend to view Linux as two different animals, rightly or wrongly.
    > There's Linux for the desktop, like Ubuntu, Gentoo, Knoppix and whatever
    > flavor-of-the-month distro gets mentioned on this week's Tekzilla.
    >
    > But really, with a 0.65 percent market share, do you really think
    > Microsoft is worried about losing out to Linux? Its biggest competitor
    > is Mac OS X, and that's still only on 7.5 percent of all computers.


    Microsoft's biggest competitive threat in the near term is its own
    installed base of satisfied XP users who don't want to change over to
    Vista. But over the longer term, Linux is a competitive threat. It is
    improving all the time. And if people end up spending 99% of their time
    in a web browser, they will eventually stop caring about the underlying
    OS.

    Charlie

  3. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    [snips]

    On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 21:28:28 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:

    > But really, with a 0.65 percent market share, do you really think
    > Microsoft is worried about losing out to Linux?


    Their own documents - memos and the like - suggest that they *are*
    worried about Linux. With a supposed 0.65% market share, why would they
    be? Oh, right, because whatever else they might be, they're not the sort
    of drooling morons who think "market share" means anything in terms of
    usage, particularly when dealing with products which are readily
    available legally free.

    > So, should Microsoft be afraid of Linux? I really doubt it. I honestly
    > can't see regular users switching away from Windows, pirated or
    > otherwise, to Linux.


    Yeah, isn't it amazing how people will *pay* for insecure, bug-ridden
    crap when better stuff is available cheaper or free? Well, one cannot
    help morons; they will be morons regardless of what one does. The ones
    with IQs larger than their shoe sizes, however, at least have viable
    options. Whether they choose them or not is up to them... but one might
    note that there's a well-funded FUD campaign against such tools; why
    would that be, if they're so insignificant?


  4. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    Charlie Wilkes wrote:

    > On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 21:28:28 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
    >
    >> http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/03/28...x-2008-should-

    > microsoft-be-afraid-of-linux/
    >>
    >>
    >> I tend to view Linux as two different animals, rightly or wrongly.
    >> There's Linux for the desktop, like Ubuntu, Gentoo, Knoppix and whatever
    >> flavor-of-the-month distro gets mentioned on this week's Tekzilla.
    >>
    >> But really, with a 0.65 percent market share, do you really think
    >> Microsoft is worried about losing out to Linux? Its biggest competitor
    >> is Mac OS X, and that's still only on 7.5 percent of all computers.

    >
    > Microsoft's biggest competitive threat in the near term is its own
    > installed base of satisfied XP users who don't want to change over to
    > Vista. But over the longer term, Linux is a competitive threat. It is
    > improving all the time. And if people end up spending 99% of their time
    > in a web browser, they will eventually stop caring about the underlying
    > OS.


    So yet another idiot troll again pulls figures out of its arse. Even M$ Execs
    have admitted that (in sworn testimony before Courts, in 2005) Linux users made
    up over 17% of all Internet users with a growth rate of >3% per annum.
    They have also said this in every quarterly SEC filing.
    Who would know the competition better than Microsoft?
    Why, the idiot trolls would of course. Riiiiiiiiiight....

    --
    Mandriva - 2008.1 - RC2 - 64bit OS.
    COLA trolls: http://colatrolls.blogspot.com/

  5. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?


    "William Poaster" wrote in message
    news:l5k1c5-08b.ln1@mandriva2008.archimedes.eu...
    > Charlie Wilkes wrote:
    >
    >> On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 21:28:28 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
    >>
    >>> http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/03/28...x-2008-should-

    >> microsoft-be-afraid-of-linux/
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> I tend to view Linux as two different animals, rightly or wrongly.
    >>> There's Linux for the desktop, like Ubuntu, Gentoo, Knoppix and
    >>> whatever
    >>> flavor-of-the-month distro gets mentioned on this week's Tekzilla.
    >>>
    >>> But really, with a 0.65 percent market share, do you really think
    >>> Microsoft is worried about losing out to Linux? Its biggest competitor
    >>> is Mac OS X, and that's still only on 7.5 percent of all computers.

    >>
    >> Microsoft's biggest competitive threat in the near term is its own
    >> installed base of satisfied XP users who don't want to change over to
    >> Vista. But over the longer term, Linux is a competitive threat. It is
    >> improving all the time. And if people end up spending 99% of their time
    >> in a web browser, they will eventually stop caring about the underlying
    >> OS.

    >
    > So yet another idiot troll again pulls figures out of its arse. Even M$
    > Execs
    > have admitted that (in sworn testimony before Courts, in 2005) Linux
    > users made
    > up over 17% of all Internet users with a growth rate of >3% per annum.


    Link? Oh... that's right. You heard this for a "reliable source" that sent
    you an anonymous email.



    > They have also said this in every quarterly SEC filing.


    Here's a list of all their quarterly and annual filings. Guess what...
    you're full of ****.

    http://finance.yahoo.com/q/sec?s=MSFT





    > Who would know the competition better than Microsoft?
    > Why, the idiot trolls would of course. Riiiiiiiiiight....
    >
    > --
    > Mandriva - 2008.1 - RC2 - 64bit OS.
    > COLA trolls: http://colatrolls.blogspot.com/




    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


  6. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    William Poaster espoused:
    > Charlie Wilkes wrote:
    >
    >> On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 21:28:28 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
    >>
    >>> http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/03/28...x-2008-should-

    >> microsoft-be-afraid-of-linux/
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> I tend to view Linux as two different animals, rightly or wrongly.
    >>> There's Linux for the desktop, like Ubuntu, Gentoo, Knoppix and whatever
    >>> flavor-of-the-month distro gets mentioned on this week's Tekzilla.
    >>>
    >>> But really, with a 0.65 percent market share, do you really think
    >>> Microsoft is worried about losing out to Linux? Its biggest competitor
    >>> is Mac OS X, and that's still only on 7.5 percent of all computers.

    >>
    >> Microsoft's biggest competitive threat in the near term is its own
    >> installed base of satisfied XP users who don't want to change over to
    >> Vista. But over the longer term, Linux is a competitive threat. It is
    >> improving all the time. And if people end up spending 99% of their time
    >> in a web browser, they will eventually stop caring about the underlying
    >> OS.

    >
    > So yet another idiot troll again pulls figures out of its arse. Even M$ Execs
    > have admitted that (in sworn testimony before Courts, in 2005) Linux users made
    > up over 17% of all Internet users with a growth rate of >3% per annum.
    > They have also said this in every quarterly SEC filing.
    > Who would know the competition better than Microsoft?
    > Why, the idiot trolls would of course. Riiiiiiiiiight....
    >


    The rate is rising fast - the current bestsellers for laptops at Amazon:

    1. Asus Eee
    2. Macbook
    3. Asus Eee
    4. Asus Eee
    5. Macbook

    My suspicion is that 17% would be a singularly underestimated figure for
    2008.

    --
    | mark at ellandroad dot demon dot co dot uk |
    | Cola faq: http://www.faqs.org/faqs/linux/advocacy/faq-and-primer/ |
    | Cola trolls: http://colatrolls.blogspot.com/ |
    | Open platforms prevent vendor lock-in. Own your Own services! |


  7. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?


    "Kelsey Bjarnason" wrote in message
    newskd1c5-o53.ln1@spanky.localhost.net...
    >
    > Yeah, isn't it amazing how people will *pay* for insecure, bug-ridden
    > crap when better stuff is available cheaper or free? Well, one cannot
    > help morons; they will be morons regardless of what one does. The ones
    > with IQs larger than their shoe sizes, however, at least have viable
    > options. Whether they choose them or not is up to them... but one might


    Well, whether they are morons or simply uninformed, nothing is going to
    change as long as the Linux advocates chose to demean them rather than
    assist.


    > note that there's a well-funded FUD campaign against such tools; why
    > would that be, if they're so insignificant?
    >


    That smacks of an extreme paranoia, which seems to be a common
    characteristic of the Linux advocate. However do you arrive at the notion
    that those who do not accept your quasi-moralistic nonsense about the
    superiority of "the open source model" and the somehow superior performance
    of the quaint code used therein are all in the pay of Microsoft? Surely, if
    people can be Linux advocates on their own volition, they can be anti-Linux
    as well?


  8. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?


    "Charlie Wilkes" wrote in message
    newsan.2008.03.29.18.16.57@users.easynews.com...
    >
    > Yes. Microsoft has the weight of inertia to help perpetuate the Windows
    > brand. We will see how much longer that inertia holds.
    >

    The inertia is the mass times the velocity and to change that you have to
    apply some force in the opposite direction. With next to zero force being
    applied as is the case today, the inertia isn't going to change very much
    and certainly not very soon.


  9. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 17:55:47 -0400, amicus_curious wrote:

    > "Charlie Wilkes" wrote in message
    > newsan.2008.03.29.18.16.57@users.easynews.com...
    >>
    >> Yes. Microsoft has the weight of inertia to help perpetuate the
    >> Windows brand. We will see how much longer that inertia holds.
    >>

    > The inertia is the mass times the velocity and to change that you have
    > to apply some force in the opposite direction. With next to zero force
    > being applied as is the case today, the inertia isn't going to change
    > very much and certainly not very soon.


    But, but, but...
    .... your buddies here don't believe in inertia.

    --
    Rick

  10. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    "Rick" stated in post 13utfkv4baet58b@news.supernews.com
    on 3/29/08 3:11 PM:

    > On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 17:55:47 -0400, amicus_curious wrote:
    >
    >> "Charlie Wilkes" wrote in message
    >> newsan.2008.03.29.18.16.57@users.easynews.com...
    >>>
    >>> Yes. Microsoft has the weight of inertia to help perpetuate the
    >>> Windows brand. We will see how much longer that inertia holds.
    >>>

    >> The inertia is the mass times the velocity and to change that you have
    >> to apply some force in the opposite direction. With next to zero force
    >> being applied as is the case today, the inertia isn't going to change
    >> very much and certainly not very soon.

    >
    > But, but, but...
    > ... your buddies here don't believe in inertia.
    >

    Who doesn't? Be specific.

    Rick runs in 3... 2... 1...


    --
    "If you have integrity, nothing else matters." - Alan Simpson




  11. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 17:55:47 -0400, amicus_curious wrote:

    > "Charlie Wilkes" wrote in message
    > newsan.2008.03.29.18.16.57@users.easynews.com...
    >>
    >> Yes. Microsoft has the weight of inertia to help perpetuate the
    >> Windows brand. We will see how much longer that inertia holds.
    >>

    > The inertia is the mass times the velocity and to change that you have
    > to apply some force in the opposite direction. With next to zero force
    > being applied as is the case today, the inertia isn't going to change
    > very much and certainly not very soon.


    To extend the metaphor even further, you need to take friction into
    account. Friction in this case is the cost of a Windows license.
    Individual users don't notice it because it is hidden in the cost of a
    new system and may be offset by crapware fees. But for businesses,
    software licenses are a big expense. If they can reduce or eliminate
    that expense, they will. Until recently, most businesses have concluded
    that the extra training/file conversion costs of Linux are greater than
    the savings to be had by eliminating license fees. But Linux is getting
    better all the time, and so the value equation is changing. If large
    companies start converting their office computers to Linux, OEMs will be
    more than happy to accommodate them, and some of the people who get
    accustomed to Linux in the office will start to use it at home, too.

    SaaS is also a factor. We just had the Photoshop Express announcement as
    the latest confirmation that this is really going somewhere. And Google
    is pushing hard to sell SaaS to businesses. Someone whose frame of
    reference is a web browser may not notice or care about the underlying
    OS, as long as everything works right.

    On Usenet, there seem to be two hostile camps: Linux evangelists who
    claim Microsoft is on the verge of going out of business because Vista is
    so bad, and Windows reactionaries who insist that the Windows monopoly is
    as strong as ever and basically immune to forces of change. Between them
    lies a scarred and pitted no man's land, deadly to all but those who are
    interested in the truth.

    Charlie

  12. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    Charlie Wilkes wrote:

    > On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 17:55:47 -0400, amicus_curious wrote:
    >
    >> "Charlie Wilkes" wrote in message
    >> newsan.2008.03.29.18.16.57@users.easynews.com...
    >>>
    >>> Yes. Microsoft has the weight of inertia to help perpetuate the
    >>> Windows brand. We will see how much longer that inertia holds.
    >>>

    >> The inertia is the mass times the velocity and to change that you have
    >> to apply some force in the opposite direction. With next to zero force
    >> being applied as is the case today, the inertia isn't going to change
    >> very much and certainly not very soon.

    >
    > To extend the metaphor even further, you need to take friction into
    > account. Friction in this case is the cost of a Windows license.
    > Individual users don't notice it because it is hidden in the cost of a
    > new system and may be offset by crapware fees. But for businesses,
    > software licenses are a big expense. If they can reduce or eliminate
    > that expense, they will. Until recently, most businesses have concluded
    > that the extra training/file conversion costs of Linux are greater than
    > the savings to be had by eliminating license fees. But Linux is getting
    > better all the time, and so the value equation is changing. If large
    > companies start converting their office computers to Linux, OEMs will be
    > more than happy to accommodate them, and some of the people who get
    > accustomed to Linux in the office will start to use it at home, too.
    >
    > SaaS is also a factor. We just had the Photoshop Express announcement as
    > the latest confirmation that this is really going somewhere. And Google
    > is pushing hard to sell SaaS to businesses. Someone whose frame of
    > reference is a web browser may not notice or care about the underlying
    > OS, as long as everything works right.
    >
    > On Usenet, there seem to be two hostile camps: Linux evangelists who
    > claim Microsoft is on the verge of going out of business because Vista is
    > so bad, and Windows reactionaries who insist that the Windows monopoly is
    > as strong as ever and basically immune to forces of change. Between them
    > lies a scarred and pitted no man's land, deadly to all but those who are
    > interested in the truth.


    FYI amicus_curious is Bill Weisgerber.

    Google for Bill Weisgerber and you will see that this twat has done
    his shill service for MS for years, always in the same *extremely* dishonest
    way.

    --
    Mandriva - 2008.1 - RC2 - 64bit OS.
    COLA trolls: http://colatrolls.blogspot.com/

  13. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 20:01:53 -0500, DFS wrote:

    > William Poaster wrote:
    >
    >> Google for Bill Weisgerber and you will see that this twat has done
    >> his shill service for MS for years, always in the same *extremely*
    >> dishonest way.

    >
    > Show us a single lie he posted, Dumb Willie. You can't, and you won't.
    >
    > Nor can you produce the lies you claim I made.
    >
    > Go work on your killfiles some more.


    Yea, for someone who claims to have superior filters that block all this
    discussion, he sure seems to have an obsession with replying.

    Not that it matters though because William Poaster never says anything of
    value.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  14. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    Moshe Goldfarb writes:

    > On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 20:01:53 -0500, DFS wrote:
    >
    >> William Poaster wrote:
    >>
    >>> Google for Bill Weisgerber and you will see that this twat has done
    >>> his shill service for MS for years, always in the same *extremely*
    >>> dishonest way.

    >>
    >> Show us a single lie he posted, Dumb Willie. You can't, and you won't.
    >>
    >> Nor can you produce the lies you claim I made.
    >>
    >> Go work on your killfiles some more.

    >
    > Yea, for someone who claims to have superior filters that block all this
    > discussion, he sure seems to have an obsession with replying.
    >
    > Not that it matters though because William Poaster never says anything of
    > value.


    It has been mentioned by a few that he is possibly the most useless, and
    boring, poaster ever to poast to usenet. He's also a laughing stock in
    the Ubuntu group where he and fellow "old fogey" Harold Stevens just
    keep waffling on about Linux 10 years ago and how they kill file
    people. Neither has ever, so much as once, poasted a single "help"
    poast. Which is clear, as otherwise it would be a post and not a poast.

    --
    * james would be more impressed if netgod's magic powers could stop the
    splits in the first place...
    * netgod notes debian developers are notoriously hard to impress
    -- Seen on #Debian

  15. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 01:46:54 +0100, Hadron wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb writes:
    >
    >> On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 20:01:53 -0500, DFS wrote:
    >>
    >>> William Poaster wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Google for Bill Weisgerber and you will see that this twat has done
    >>>> his shill service for MS for years, always in the same *extremely*
    >>>> dishonest way.
    >>>
    >>> Show us a single lie he posted, Dumb Willie. You can't, and you won't.
    >>>
    >>> Nor can you produce the lies you claim I made.
    >>>
    >>> Go work on your killfiles some more.

    >>
    >> Yea, for someone who claims to have superior filters that block all this
    >> discussion, he sure seems to have an obsession with replying.
    >>
    >> Not that it matters though because William Poaster never says anything of
    >> value.

    >
    > It has been mentioned by a few that he is possibly the most useless, and
    > boring, poaster ever to poast to usenet. He's also a laughing stock in
    > the Ubuntu group where he and fellow "old fogey" Harold Stevens just
    > keep waffling on about Linux 10 years ago and how they kill file
    > people. Neither has ever, so much as once, poasted a single "help"
    > poast. Which is clear, as otherwise it would be a post and not a poast.


    Yea, despite the problems Ubuntu seems to be having, the community is
    rather friendly and they don't take lightly to rabid Linux zealots, like
    Poaster.

    Getting back to the OP, of course Microsoft *fears* Linux.
    Not in the sense that Linux will overtake them, but just that they should
    never neglect any potential opponent.
    Anything can happen.

    It's the arrogant fool that ignores his competition, no matter how small,
    that gets caught with his pants down.

    Just ask Roy Schestowitz who ignored warnings that his server was doing
    funny things, refused to fix it and then got hacked.

    You don't have to *fear* your enemy, but you should never underestimate
    your enemy.


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  16. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    William Poaster wrote:

    > Google for Bill Weisgerber and you will see that this twat has done
    > his shill service for MS for years, always in the same *extremely*
    > dishonest way.


    Show us a single lie he posted, Dumb Willie. You can't, and you won't.

    Nor can you produce the lies you claim I made.

    Go work on your killfiles some more.








  17. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?

    amicus_curious wrote:

    > You could put it that way, but you would look like a silly dilletante.
    > There is not much of any consequence on usenet. *The Linux folk are hardly
    > evangelists and they are just hoping and wishing for a change that never
    > seems to come. *The Windows fans are, of course, correct and only trying
    > to save the Linux folk from their sins. *Think of us as Christian
    > missionaries to snake worshipers and other socially backward heathens.


    Yep, 24/7 obsessed with Linux -- no worries about Linux in the Micro$haft
    camp at all. If you're going to make a career out of lying, you should at
    least get good at it, lying troll.

    --
    RonB
    "There's a story there...somewhere"

  18. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?


  19. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?


  20. Re: Does Microsoft fear Linux? Should it fear Linux?


    "RonB" wrote in message
    news:ktCHj.69$v76.40@newsfe06.lga...
    > amicus_curious wrote:
    >
    >> You could put it that way, but you would look like a silly dilletante.
    >> There is not much of any consequence on usenet. The Linux folk are hardly
    >> evangelists and they are just hoping and wishing for a change that never
    >> seems to come. The Windows fans are, of course, correct and only trying
    >> to save the Linux folk from their sins. Think of us as Christian
    >> missionaries to snake worshipers and other socially backward heathens.

    >
    > Yep, 24/7 obsessed with Linux -- no worries about Linux in the Micro$haft
    > camp at all. If you're going to make a career out of lying, you should at
    > least get good at it, lying troll.
    >

    A trite and limp response.


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