RonB wrote:

> Pentium Celeron 366

Ummm... Celereon 366, that is. One of them that PeoplePC originally gave
away if you signed for their Internet access.

--
RonB
"There's a story there...somewhere"

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 00:00:29 -0500, RonB wrote:
>My wife's niece needed a "new" computer. Her's is getting long in the tooth,
>a Pentium Celeron 366, and her husband thinks computers are a waste of
>time. I saw a Gateway E 4100 in a second hand store on clearance for $125
>with monitor and keyboard. The E 4100 is a 2.4 Ghz with a Hyper Threading
>Pentium 4. Probably not that impressive to most folks reading this, but
>faster than anything I've ever used. My wife, however, has a little newer
>Gateway that runs at 3 Ghz, so she thought this would be great for her
>niece.

>Got the computer home. The old owners had added a video card that didn't
>work -- so I took that out and used the onboard video adapter. Booted okay,
>but pretty slow. Once in XP, programs wouldn't open, flaky behavior,
>couldn't change the refresh rate, etc -- obviously tons of malware -- which
>was fine, I figured I was going to reload XP anyhow. But I'm pretty sure
>that's why the old owners got rid of it. I don't have the Gateway restore
>disk, so I used an XP OEM disk from Dell. Legal, I've got the COA on the
>back of the Gateway, and once XP was loaded (and I got on the Internet) it
>activated fine -- but there was a bit of a hassle getting there.

>XP loaded fine, but the onboard Network card didn't work, the onboard sound
>card didn't work, the USB ports didn't work -- the video card worked but I
>couldn't adjust the refresh rate and it was stuck at 60hz. Ugh. So I needed
>drivers. Wait a minute, I can't get to the Internet. Time to shut off the
>Gateway and boot up my SuSE Dell. Just download the drivers to the portable
>USB drive... oh wait a minute, the USB drive doesn't work because the USB
>ports are down. Alright I'll download the drivers and burn a CD... Then it
>occurred to me. I'll just boot Mint Linux (I had a CD handy) and download
>the drivers to get Windows working. Which I did. Mint Linux had no trouble
>with the network card, the sound card or USB drives. Ahhh yes... this is
>why I like Linux.

>The needed drivers safely downloaded, I booted back into XP. Loaded the
>drivers, starting with the motherboard drivers, rebooted XP five times
>altogether and everything was working fine. Activated XP, started
>downloading updates. It rebooted again (at least this 2.4 mhz machine
>reboots fast) -- got to the 61 file security upgrade marathon Windows XP
>always runs you through. Meanwhile I had downloaded Firefox, AVG
>AntiSpyware and anti-Virus, Flash, even scanned the computer for malware
>(already had 20-some infections). Then I let Windows install the 61
>security patches, rebooted. My Free Anti-Virus software came up
>complaining that it couldn't find its license. Alright, I'll uninstall it
>and download it again.

>Ah crap. Now the network card is down. Why? I haven't got a clue. Tried
>releasing and renewing it. Tried rebooting. Nope, nope. Went into Device
>Manager, removed the network card and let XP find it again. Then released
>and renewed the network card. Success. So, what in the hell in the upgrade
>took down my network card? Sheesh! But I'm used to doing this in Windows.
>I'm used to soundcards that just quit working, until you uninstall and
>reinstall them -- it's a been a pretty good "fix" in Windows for years. I
>don't have to do that in Linux. I don't have to download Anti-Spyware or
>Anti-Virus software. I don't have to search all over the Internet for
>drivers. Unknown to me, Gateway's business machines were sold out to MPC --
>that division didn't become part of Acer. If I had loaded Linux on the
>machine instead of XP, I still wouldn't have known that -- I wouldn't have
>had any reason to learn it.

>At any rate, it's working now... I think. I haven't let it update anymore
>yet, and I have rebooted it again -- and the network card came back up. I'm
>typing this on Google documents. Windows doesn't come with a business Word
>Processor installed and, besides, I want to be able to download this to
>KNode when I get back into Linux.

>What is it you FUDites are saying? Linux is hard to install? Yeah, right.

I hope you didn't install WGA. It offers no advantage other than
making windows update take 5-20 minutes to startup. Use firefox and
http://windizupdate.62nds.com/ instead. It simply installs the critical
updates needed and won't disable your computer if microsoft decides you
haven't paid them enough lately.

RonB :
> AntiSpyware and anti-Virus, Flash, even scanned the computer for malware
> (already had 20-some infections). Then I let Windows install the 61
> security patches, rebooted. My Free Anti-Virus software came up

Lucky bugger, the machine I installed XP on today needed 84.

Windows installs will always be more difficult than Linux installs. They
have to be very sure that you aren't stealing anything.

--
Hackers do it with all sorts of characters.

www.websterscafe.com

AZ Nomad wrote:

> I hope you didn't install WGA. Â*It offers no advantage other than
> making windows update take 5-20 minutes to startup. Â*Use firefox and
> http://windizupdate.62nds.com/ instead. Â*It simply installs the critical
> updates needed and won't disable your computer if microsoft decides you
> haven't paid them enough lately.

I don't even know what WGA is -- so, I'm afraid, I probably installed it.

--
RonB
"There's a story there...somewhere"

Wow, Ron. You really need to get your story straight. You contradict
yourself several times.

For example:

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 00:00:29 -0500, RonB wrote:

> The E 4100 is a 2.4 Ghz with a Hyper Threading
> Pentium 4. Probably not that impressive to most folks reading this, but
> faster than anything I've ever used.

Ok, 2.4 Ghz is faster than anything you've ever used. Wow, that's amazing
in and of itself.

> My wife, however, has a little newer Gateway that runs at 3 Ghz, so she
> thought this would be great for her niece.

You've never used your wifes computer? I find that hard to believe. But
there you said 2.4Ghz is faster than anything you've ever used.

> So I needed
> drivers. Wait a minute, I can't get to the Internet. Time to shut off the
> Gateway and boot up my SuSE Dell.

What, you can't have two computers on at the same time?

> Alright I'll download the drivers and burn a CD... Then it
> occurred to me. I'll just boot Mint Linux (I had a CD handy) and download
> the drivers to get Windows working. Which I did. Mint Linux had no trouble
> with the network card, the sound card or USB drives. Ahhh yes... this is
> why I like Linux.

As is usual with people who make this argument, they take a 6 month old (or
less) copy of Linux and compare it to a 7 year old copy of Windows, then
complain because Windows can't find the hardware for devices that didn't
even exist when it was created.

I bet if you took a copy of Linux from the same time-frame it wouldn't know
about the hardware either. But yeah, somehow this is a positive for Linux,
and a negative for Windows. And, instead of using a version of Windows with
current drivers you'd rather complain about how something 7 years old
doesn't know what something 2 years old looks like.

> even scanned the computer for malware (already had 20-some infections).

I call bull**** on this. Unless you were off looking for hacked versions
of programs, going to only to the sites to download the programs you
mentioned could not have caused you to get any malware. Windows XP will
not autmatically contract malware simply by being exposed the internet.
You have to actively visit a site that will exploit a vulnerability you
haven't patched yet, and installing those programs you mentioned would not
have done that.

> I'm
> typing this on Google documents. Windows doesn't come with a business Word
> Processor installed

And you need a word processor to type a message you intend to post to a
newsgroup? Wordpad would work just fine, as would notepad.

> and, besides, I want to be able to download this to KNode when I get back
> into Linux.

That's a valid reason, but your previous one is bull****.

> What is it you FUDites are saying? Linux is hard to install? Yeah, right.

What would you say if I tried to install a 7 year old copy of Linux on a
recent computer and had all kinds of problems? Who would you blame?

Think about it.

> And, BTW, this computer has a DVD player installed. What do you think my
> chances are of playing a movie in it right now?

About the same as being able to legally play a DVD on Linux in the US.

> A few more updates and a few more reboots, installing Nero and PowerDVD and
> the thing is ready to send. Now I'm back using Linux.

Why do you need Nero when you only have a DVD-Player? Odd.

Handover Phist wrote:

> Lucky bugger, the machine I installed XP on today needed 84.
>
> Windows installs will always be more difficult than Linux installs. They
> have to be very sure that you aren't stealing anything.

The second round of updates -- after I updated to SP2 -- required another
50+ security patches. The only thing I didn't let it load was IE 7.

Too bad we aren't all using Linux.

--
RonB
"There's a story there...somewhere"

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 01:36:45 -0400, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:

> Wow, Ron. You really need to get your story straight. You contradict
> yourself several times.
>
> For example:
>
> On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 00:00:29 -0500, RonB wrote:
>
>> The E 4100 is a 2.4 Ghz with a Hyper Threading
>> Pentium 4. Probably not that impressive to most folks reading this, but
>> faster than anything I've ever used.
>
> Ok, 2.4 Ghz is faster than anything you've ever used. Wow, that's amazing
> in and of itself.
>
>> My wife, however, has a little newer Gateway that runs at 3 Ghz, so she
>> thought this would be great for her niece.
>
> You've never used your wifes computer? I find that hard to believe. But
> there you said 2.4Ghz is faster than anything you've ever used.
>
>> So I needed
>> drivers. Wait a minute, I can't get to the Internet. Time to shut off the
>> Gateway and boot up my SuSE Dell.
>
> What, you can't have two computers on at the same time?
>
>> Alright I'll download the drivers and burn a CD... Then it
>> occurred to me. I'll just boot Mint Linux (I had a CD handy) and download
>> the drivers to get Windows working. Which I did. Mint Linux had no trouble
>> with the network card, the sound card or USB drives. Ahhh yes... this is
>> why I like Linux.
>
> As is usual with people who make this argument, they take a 6 month old (or
> less) copy of Linux and compare it to a 7 year old copy of Windows, then
> complain because Windows can't find the hardware for devices that didn't
> even exist when it was created.
>
> I bet if you took a copy of Linux from the same time-frame it wouldn't know
> about the hardware either. But yeah, somehow this is a positive for Linux,
> and a negative for Windows. And, instead of using a version of Windows with
> current drivers you'd rather complain about how something 7 years old
> doesn't know what something 2 years old looks like.
>
>> even scanned the computer for malware (already had 20-some infections).
>
> I call bull**** on this. Unless you were off looking for hacked versions
> of programs, going to only to the sites to download the programs you
> mentioned could not have caused you to get any malware. Windows XP will
> not autmatically contract malware simply by being exposed the internet.
> You have to actively visit a site that will exploit a vulnerability you
> haven't patched yet, and installing those programs you mentioned would not
> have done that.
>
>> I'm
>> typing this on Google documents. Windows doesn't come with a business Word
>> Processor installed
>
> And you need a word processor to type a message you intend to post to a
> newsgroup? Wordpad would work just fine, as would notepad.
>
>> and, besides, I want to be able to download this to KNode when I get back
>> into Linux.
>
> That's a valid reason, but your previous one is bull****.
>
>> What is it you FUDites are saying? Linux is hard to install? Yeah, right.
>
> What would you say if I tried to install a 7 year old copy of Linux on a
> recent computer and had all kinds of problems? Who would you blame?
>
> Think about it.
>
>> And, BTW, this computer has a DVD player installed. What do you think my
>> chances are of playing a movie in it right now?
>
> About the same as being able to legally play a DVD on Linux in the US.
>
>> A few more updates and a few more reboots, installing Nero and PowerDVD and
>> the thing is ready to send. Now I'm back using Linux.
>
> Why do you need Nero when you only have a DVD-Player? Odd.

Hahaha!

Nice dissection Erik!

This guy makes Kelsey look like a Nobel Prize winner.

Rule #1 is that if you are going to make up a "Windows ruined my life"
story, at least get your facts straight.
That's where Kelsey screws up every time.

This guy RonB is a bucket of bolts though

--
Moshe Goldfarb
Collector of soaps from around the globe.
Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 01:36:45 -0400, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:

> Windows XP will
> not autmatically contract malware simply by being exposed the internet.

Is that so?

> You have to actively visit a site that will exploit a vulnerability you
> haven't patched yet, and installing those programs you mentioned would
> not have done that.

And how, pray, will the average user be able to know which sites to avoid?

See:
http://www.news.com/2100-7349_3-5313402.html


Don't connect that new PC to the Internet before taking security
precautions, researchers at the Internet Storm Center warned Tuesday.
According to the researchers, an unpatched Windows PC connected to the
Internet will last for only about 20 minutes before it's compromised by
malware, on average. That figure is down from around 40 minutes, the
group's estimate in 2003.

Erik Funkenbusch writes:

> Wow, Ron. You really need to get your story straight. You contradict
> yourself several times.

RonB is surely HPT? As inept and almost as boring.

>
> For example:
>
> On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 00:00:29 -0500, RonB wrote:
>
>> The E 4100 is a 2.4 Ghz with a Hyper Threading
>> Pentium 4. Probably not that impressive to most folks reading this, but
>> faster than anything I've ever used.
>
> Ok, 2.4 Ghz is faster than anything you've ever used. Wow, that's amazing
> in and of itself.

Yup.

>
>> My wife, however, has a little newer Gateway that runs at 3 Ghz, so she
>> thought this would be great for her niece.
>
> You've never used your wifes computer? I find that hard to believe. But
> there you said 2.4Ghz is faster than anything you've ever used.

And the "I have a woman" pose - a bit of a "He Man" amongst COLA zealots.

>
>> So I needed
>> drivers. Wait a minute, I can't get to the Internet. Time to shut off the
>> Gateway and boot up my SuSE Dell.
>
> What, you can't have two computers on at the same time?

Or run two lies it seems.

>
>> Alright I'll download the drivers and burn a CD... Then it
>> occurred to me. I'll just boot Mint Linux (I had a CD handy) and download
>> the drivers to get Windows working. Which I did. Mint Linux had no trouble
>> with the network card, the sound card or USB drives. Ahhh yes... this is
>> why I like Linux.
>
> As is usual with people who make this argument, they take a 6 month old (or
> less) copy of Linux and compare it to a 7 year old copy of Windows, then
> complain because Windows can't find the hardware for devices that didn't
> even exist when it was created.
>
> I bet if you took a copy of Linux from the same time-frame it wouldn't know
> about the hardware either. But yeah, somehow this is a positive for Linux,
> and a negative for Windows. And, instead of using a version of Windows with
> current drivers you'd rather complain about how something 7 years old
> doesn't know what something 2 years old looks like.

Thats how they work.

>
>> even scanned the computer for malware (already had 20-some infections).
>
> I call bull**** on this. Unless you were off looking for hacked versions
> of programs, going to only to the sites to download the programs you
> mentioned could not have caused you to get any malware. Windows XP will
> not autmatically contract malware simply by being exposed the internet.
> You have to actively visit a site that will exploit a vulnerability you
> haven't patched yet, and installing those programs you mentioned would not
> have done that.

He is a documented liar.

>
>> I'm
>> typing this on Google documents. Windows doesn't come with a business Word
>> Processor installed
>
> And you need a word processor to type a message you intend to post to a
> newsgroup? Wordpad would work just fine, as would notepad.

Or Open Office which, as on Linux, is a download away.

>
>> and, besides, I want to be able to download this to KNode when I get back
>> into Linux.
>
> That's a valid reason, but your previous one is bull****.
>
>> What is it you FUDites are saying? Linux is hard to install? Yeah, right.
>
> What would you say if I tried to install a 7 year old copy of Linux on a
> recent computer and had all kinds of problems? Who would you blame?
>
> Think about it.
>
>> And, BTW, this computer has a DVD player installed. What do you think my
>> chances are of playing a movie in it right now?
>
> About the same as being able to legally play a DVD on Linux in the US.
>
>> A few more updates and a few more reboots, installing Nero and PowerDVD and
>> the thing is ready to send. Now I'm back using Linux.
>
> Why do you need Nero when you only have a DVD-Player? Odd.

* Erik Funkenbusch peremptorily fired off this memo:

> As is usual with people who make this argument, they take a 6 month old (or
> less) copy of Linux and compare it to a 7 year old copy of Windows, then
> complain because Windows can't find the hardware for devices that didn't
> even exist when it was created.

But, but, I thought SP2 for XP was only a couple years old!

>> And, BTW, this computer has a DVD player installed. What do you think my
>> chances are of playing a movie in it right now?
>
> About the same as being able to legally play a DVD on Linux in the US.

Ah, the old DVD playback is illegal on Linux bull****.

>> A few more updates and a few more reboots, installing Nero and PowerDVD and
>> the thing is ready to send. Now I'm back using Linux.
>
> Why do you need Nero when you only have a DVD-Player? Odd.

What, will WMP play DVDs?

The fact is, unless you have all the vendor CDs, installing XP is a
royal pain in the ass, even with SP2.

Been there, done that.

--
Since when has the world of computer software design been about what people
want? This is a simple question of evolution. The day is quickly coming when
every knee will bow down to a silicon fist, and you will all beg your binary
gods for mercy.
-- Bill Gates

Robin T Cox wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 01:36:45 -0400, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:

>> Windows XP will not autmatically contract malware simply by being
>> exposed the internet.
>
> Is that so?

No, it's utter bull****. I've had an XP system infected /before/ the OS
had even completed /re-installing/!!! Specifically the Blaster worm,
which caused the infamous "Windows must now restart because the RPC
service terminated unexpectedly" continuous reboot cycle.

>> You have to actively visit a site that will exploit a vulnerability
>> you haven't patched yet, and installing those programs you
>> mentioned would not have done that.
>
> And how, pray, will the average user be able to know which sites to
> avoid?

Presumably anything in the Microsoft netblocks, for a start, if just
installing the OS causes infection. Then again, with Windows chronic
insecurity, it's just as likely to be an unsolicited incoming attack.

> See: http://www.news.com/2100-7349_3-5313402.html
>
> Don't connect that new PC to the Internet before taking
> security precautions, researchers at the Internet Storm Center warned
> Tuesday. According to the researchers, an unpatched Windows PC
> connected to the Internet will last for only about 20 minutes before
> it's compromised by malware, on average. That figure is down from
> around 40 minutes, the group's estimate in 2003.

More like about 20 seconds, IME.

--
K.
http://slated.org

..----
| 'When it comes to knowledge, "ownership" just doesn't make sense'
| ~ Cory Doctorow, The Guardian. http://tinyurl.com/22bgx8
`----

Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.23.8-63.fc8
11:51:18 up 83 days, 9:27, 4 users, load average: 0.05, 0.06, 0.08

[H]omer wrote:

>> See: http://www.news.com/2100-7349_3-5313402.html
>>
>> Don't connect that new PC to the Internet before taking
>> security precautions, researchers at the Internet Storm Center warned
>> Tuesday. According to the researchers, an unpatched Windows PC
>> connected to the Internet will last for only about 20 minutes before
>> it's compromised by malware, on average. That figure is down from
>> around 40 minutes, the group's estimate in 2003.
>
>More like about 20 seconds, IME.

It's really amazing that M$ hasn't released an XP SP3, or other
security roll-up release. A new SP2 install is literally years
behind, until the lengthily update process is done.

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 00:34:56 -0500, RonB wrote:
>AZ Nomad wrote:

>> I hope you didn't install WGA. *It offers no advantage other than
>> making windows update take 5-20 minutes to startup. *Use firefox and
>> http://windizupdate.62nds.com/ instead. *It simply installs the critical
>> updates needed and won't disable your computer if microsoft decides you
>> haven't paid them enough lately.

>I don't even know what WGA is -- so, I'm afraid, I probably installed it.
You might seriously considering starting over. WGA is serious malware.

With spybot, you can probably remove it. Windows update will break, but
you can use windizupdate instead. You'll also be denied some bloatware
like media player 10+, but you can download a full ("redist") copy from
elsewhere and install it without the WGA check. I think. Or better yet,
use somebody'e else's media player. Nearly all are superior.

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 07:17:24 -0500, Sinister Midget wrote:
>On 2008-03-13, Erik Funkenbusch claimed:

>>> Alright I'll download the drivers and burn a CD... Then it
>>> occurred to me. I'll just boot Mint Linux (I had a CD handy) and download
>>> the drivers to get Windows working. Which I did. Mint Linux had no trouble
>>> with the network card, the sound card or USB drives. Ahhh yes... this is
>>> why I like Linux.
>>
>> As is usual with people who make this argument, they take a 6 month old (or
>> less) copy of Linux and compare it to a 7 year old copy of Windows, then
>> complain because Windows can't find the hardware for devices that didn't
>> even exist when it was created.

>You're right. Network cards weren't invented until somewhere around
>'05. USB is even newer than that. And sound cards, hell, those things
>are so new it's a wonder they work on /anything/ yet.

You amazing idiot. Where did you get the insane notion that every
single network card and usb driver uses the same hardware since they
were first invented?

XP can't even handle a realtek 8139 without a driver disk and it is the
most popular network 10/100 network interface used in the last 10 years.

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 07:44:56 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>[H]omer wrote:

>>> See: http://www.news.com/2100-7349_3-5313402.html
>>>
>>> Don't connect that new PC to the Internet before taking
>>> security precautions, researchers at the Internet Storm Center warned
>>> Tuesday. According to the researchers, an unpatched Windows PC
>>> connected to the Internet will last for only about 20 minutes before
>>> it's compromised by malware, on average. That figure is down from
>>> around 40 minutes, the group's estimate in 2003.
>>
>>More like about 20 seconds, IME.

>It's really amazing that M$ hasn't released an XP SP3, or other
>security roll-up release. A new SP2 install is literally years
>behind, until the lengthily update process is done.

That would mean that XP still exists.

Microsoft is still at war against hackers with their WGA. They're on probably
their sixth version and all have been broken. Perhaps microsoft is waiting
until they make what they think is an unbreakable WGA before they assemble
a new service pack.

Sinister Midget wrote:
> On 2008-03-13, Erik Funkenbusch
> claimed:

>> As is usual with people who make this argument, they take a 6 month
>> old (or less) copy of Linux and compare it to a 7 year old copy of
>> Windows, then complain because Windows can't find the hardware for
>> devices that didn't even exist when it was created.

Well by all means let's compare "a 6 month old (or less) copy of Linux"
with the Vole's brand-spanking new Vista, with its chronic lack of
drivers. However, usually whenever anyone mentions Vista, the Trolls
suddenly go silent, so it's a pretty short conversation.

> You're right. Network cards weren't invented until somewhere around
> '05. USB is even newer than that. And sound cards, hell, those things
> are so new it's a wonder they work on /anything/ yet.

Fuddie's just shuffling as usual. The hardware's always either "too new"
to be supported by XP, or "too old" to be supported by Vista. The funny
thing is, Linux seems to cope with most of that same hardware, both old
/and/ new. Indeed, a lot of hardware won't work even with XP, regardless
of how old or new it is (I can list several examples from personal
experience). As for Vista ... Windows 7 will probably have come and gone
before Vista even starts to get anywhere near as much hardware support
as Linux has /now/.

It's WinME all over again, only funnier.

--
K.
http://slated.org

..----
| 'When it comes to knowledge, "ownership" just doesn't make sense'
| ~ Cory Doctorow, The Guardian. http://tinyurl.com/22bgx8
`----

Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.23.8-63.fc8
14:18:04 up 83 days, 11:53, 4 users, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.04

[H]omer wrote:

> Well by all means let's compare "a 6 month old (or less) copy of
> Linux" with the Vole's brand-spanking new Vista, with its chronic
> lack of drivers. However, usually whenever anyone mentions Vista, the
> Trolls suddenly go silent, so it's a pretty short conversation.

What do you want to talk about, [C]lown?

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 07:43:55 -0400, Linonut wrote:


> Ah, the old DVD playback is illegal on Linux bull****.

Depending upon where you live it is.



--
Moshe Goldfarb
Collector of soaps from around the globe.
Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 07:43:55 -0400, Linonut wrote:

> * Erik Funkenbusch peremptorily fired off this memo:
>
>> As is usual with people who make this argument, they take a 6 month old (or
>> less) copy of Linux and compare it to a 7 year old copy of Windows, then
>> complain because Windows can't find the hardware for devices that didn't
>> even exist when it was created.
>
> But, but, I thought SP2 for XP was only a couple years old!

He didn't install XP with SP2. He installed either the GA or SP1, because
he admitted he had to install SP2 as a patch later.

>>> And, BTW, this computer has a DVD player installed. What do you think my
>>> chances are of playing a movie in it right now?
>>
>> About the same as being able to legally play a DVD on Linux in the US.
>
> Ah, the old DVD playback is illegal on Linux bull****.

In the US it is, it violates the DMCA. I agree with everyone that it
shouldn't, but it does.

>>> A few more updates and a few more reboots, installing Nero and PowerDVD and
>>> the thing is ready to send. Now I'm back using Linux.
>>
>> Why do you need Nero when you only have a DVD-Player? Odd.
>
> What, will WMP play DVDs?

If you install a codec, but that's beside the point, he installed PowerDVD
to play DVD's, Nero is pointless if you don't have a burner.

> The fact is, unless you have all the vendor CDs, installing XP is a
> royal pain in the ass, even with SP2.

The only driver you typically need is the network driver, then you can get
the rest either through Windows Update (80% of the time) or going to the
vendors site. I don't find that a pain in the ass at all.