What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth;Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales - Linux

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Thread: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth;Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

  1. What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth;Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth and Includes a Sunny Forecast
    New York Times - 9 hours ago
    By STEVE LOHR Microsoft reported quarterly sales and profit gains that
    surpassed Wall Street's expectations and delivered an optimistic
    outlook Thursday, suggesting that a weakening economy would not slow
    it down.
    Microsoft Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales Washington Post

  2. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 04:34:43 -0800 (PST), raylopez99 wrote:

    > Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth and Includes a Sunny Forecast
    > New York Times - 9 hours ago
    > By STEVE LOHR Microsoft reported quarterly sales and profit gains that
    > surpassed Wall Street's expectations and delivered an optimistic
    > outlook Thursday, suggesting that a weakening economy would not slow
    > it down.
    > Microsoft Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales Washington Post


    Roy seems to have missed this one in his daily news splorge.

  3. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    Moshe Goldfarb writes:

    > On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 04:34:43 -0800 (PST), raylopez99 wrote:
    >
    >> Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth and Includes a Sunny Forecast
    >> New York Times - 9 hours ago
    >> By STEVE LOHR Microsoft reported quarterly sales and profit gains that
    >> surpassed Wall Street's expectations and delivered an optimistic
    >> outlook Thursday, suggesting that a weakening economy would not slow
    >> it down.
    >> Microsoft Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales Washington Post

    >
    > Roy seems to have missed this one in his daily news splorge.


    I find this depressing.

    Vista is a heap of **** IMO. XP is an excellent home OS when properly
    secured.

    2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    progress. Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over
    for Linux. Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    much doomed it would appear. Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it. I actually did
    think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake. It simply has not
    happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS. Whether
    herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.

    MS increasing profits is not good for the most of us.



  4. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers StrongGrowth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    "Hadron" stated in post
    fnd3jj$or8$2@registered.motzarella.org on 1/25/08 9:43 AM:

    > Moshe Goldfarb writes:
    >
    >> On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 04:34:43 -0800 (PST), raylopez99 wrote:
    >>
    >>> Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth and Includes a Sunny Forecast
    >>> New York Times - 9 hours ago
    >>> By STEVE LOHR Microsoft reported quarterly sales and profit gains that
    >>> surpassed Wall Street's expectations and delivered an optimistic
    >>> outlook Thursday, suggesting that a weakening economy would not slow
    >>> it down.
    >>> Microsoft Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales Washington Post

    >>
    >> Roy seems to have missed this one in his daily news splorge.

    >
    > I find this depressing.
    >
    > Vista is a heap of **** IMO. XP is an excellent home OS when properly
    > secured.
    >
    > 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    > zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    > progress. Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over
    > for Linux. Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    > much doomed it would appear. Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    > invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it. I actually did
    > think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake. It simply has not
    > happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS. Whether
    > herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.
    >
    > MS increasing profits is not good for the most of us.
    >
    >

    Apple is doing well... so why can't Linux?


    --
    Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and
    conscientious stupidity. -- Martin Luther King, Jr.


  5. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 17:43:30 +0100, Hadron wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb writes:
    >
    >> On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 04:34:43 -0800 (PST), raylopez99 wrote:
    >>
    >>> Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth and Includes a Sunny Forecast
    >>> New York Times - 9 hours ago
    >>> By STEVE LOHR Microsoft reported quarterly sales and profit gains that
    >>> surpassed Wall Street's expectations and delivered an optimistic
    >>> outlook Thursday, suggesting that a weakening economy would not slow
    >>> it down.
    >>> Microsoft Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales Washington Post

    >>
    >> Roy seems to have missed this one in his daily news splorge.

    >
    > I find this depressing.


    I find it slightly depressing because I had this notion that maybe, just
    maybe, the buying public was starting to wise up.
    I use the increase in Apple Mac sales as one indicator.

    > Vista is a heap of **** IMO. XP is an excellent home OS when properly
    > secured.


    Vista is terrible, at least in it's current incarnation.
    Ubuntu's eye candy runs circles around it.
    There is a Vista vs Ubuntu video on YouToob that in an unbiased fashion
    shows how bad Vista really is compared to Linux, in the eye candy dept.

    Windows XP, properly secured is an excellent system.
    So is Linux, but Linux just does not have the applications nor is ease of
    set up, hardware support and games very good.

    > 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    > zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    > progress. Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over
    > for Linux. Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    > much doomed it would appear. Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    > invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it. I actually did
    > think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake. It simply has not
    > happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS. Whether
    > herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.


    It's the same story that happened when ME was released and when XP was
    initially released.
    Granted Linux was nowhere near as good as it is now, but neither was XP and
    let's not even talk about ME.
    Windows ME is one point where Linvocates and Winvocates can agree totally.

    > MS increasing profits is not good for the most of us.

    No it's not but until the Linux community can get it's act together, focus
    on several distributions instead of 1000's, and stop preaching like a bunch
    of loony toons about GPL etc, Linux is doomed on the desktop.

    SP1 for Vista hopefully, and I have my doubts, but hopefully, will give a
    boost to Vista both by fixing bugs and increasing it's pathetic performance
    on average machines.
    At least Microsoft hopes, I don't really care as I have no plans to use
    Vista.

  6. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 09:47:05 -0700, Snit wrote:

    > "Hadron" stated in post
    > fnd3jj$or8$2@registered.motzarella.org on 1/25/08 9:43 AM:
    >
    >> Moshe Goldfarb writes:
    >>
    >>> On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 04:34:43 -0800 (PST), raylopez99 wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth and Includes a Sunny Forecast
    >>>> New York Times - 9 hours ago
    >>>> By STEVE LOHR Microsoft reported quarterly sales and profit gains that
    >>>> surpassed Wall Street's expectations and delivered an optimistic
    >>>> outlook Thursday, suggesting that a weakening economy would not slow
    >>>> it down.
    >>>> Microsoft Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales Washington Post
    >>>
    >>> Roy seems to have missed this one in his daily news splorge.

    >>
    >> I find this depressing.
    >>
    >> Vista is a heap of **** IMO. XP is an excellent home OS when properly
    >> secured.
    >>
    >> 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    >> zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    >> progress. Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over
    >> for Linux. Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    >> much doomed it would appear. Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    >> invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it. I actually did
    >> think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake. It simply has not
    >> happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS. Whether
    >> herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.
    >>
    >> MS increasing profits is not good for the most of us.
    >>
    >>

    > Apple is doing well... so why can't Linux?


    Applications.
    Help systems.
    One stop shopping.
    Integration with personal multimedia.
    A total lack of a geek like community, that has in recent years turned from
    just plain strange and geeky to nasty and paranoid.

  7. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers StrongGrowth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    "Moshe Goldfarb" stated in post
    ovcessndmmu3.b7jku0nkgeci.dlg@40tude.net on 1/25/08 1:08 PM:

    > On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 09:47:05 -0700, Snit wrote:
    >
    >> "Hadron" stated in post
    >> fnd3jj$or8$2@registered.motzarella.org on 1/25/08 9:43 AM:
    >>
    >>> Moshe Goldfarb writes:
    >>>
    >>>> On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 04:34:43 -0800 (PST), raylopez99 wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth and Includes a Sunny Forecast
    >>>>> New York Times - 9 hours ago
    >>>>> By STEVE LOHR Microsoft reported quarterly sales and profit gains that
    >>>>> surpassed Wall Street's expectations and delivered an optimistic
    >>>>> outlook Thursday, suggesting that a weakening economy would not slow
    >>>>> it down.
    >>>>> Microsoft Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales Washington Post
    >>>>
    >>>> Roy seems to have missed this one in his daily news splorge.
    >>>
    >>> I find this depressing.
    >>>
    >>> Vista is a heap of **** IMO. XP is an excellent home OS when properly
    >>> secured.
    >>>
    >>> 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    >>> zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    >>> progress. Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over
    >>> for Linux. Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    >>> much doomed it would appear. Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    >>> invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it. I actually did
    >>> think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake. It simply has not
    >>> happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS. Whether
    >>> herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.
    >>>
    >>> MS increasing profits is not good for the most of us.
    >>>
    >>>

    >> Apple is doing well... so why can't Linux?

    >
    > Applications.
    > Help systems.
    > One stop shopping.
    > Integration with personal multimedia.
    > A total lack of a geek like community, that has in recent years turned from
    > just plain strange and geeky to nasty and paranoid.


    Well, other than that?

    --
    "The music is not inside the piano." - Alan Kay


  8. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    In article ,
    Hadron wrote:
    > 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    > zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    > progress.


    Indeed. If a company decides to offer a Linux box, there is widespread
    initial cheering, then the zealots start finding fault.

    The company picked the wrong distribution. The company isn't offering
    enough distributions. The company said "Ubuntu" on a web page when they
    should have said "Linux". The company said "Linux" when they should
    have said "GNU/Linux". The Linux product page is too hard to find. The
    price difference between the Linux box and their similar Windows boxes
    is too low. The company should be offering a no-OS version for people
    who want to install a different distribution. The company didn't follow
    the GPL correctly. The company didn't offer the right video card. The
    company is not *really* behind Linux--it is just some tactic to try to
    Microsoft to give them a better deal on Windows, or they are offering a
    small number of Linux systems so Microsoft can say that Microsoft
    doesn't have a monopoly. The company is a company.

    Some random member of the public thinking about that box who does a
    little web research will find all that crap, and that will make it seem
    a lot safer to buy another Windows box, or maybe give Apple try.

    And then there are the zealots who use weird arguments for desktop
    Linux. For example, some cell phones use Linux, so you should use it on
    your desktop. Do these people live in some alternate universe where
    people generally *like* cell phone software and go around saying "I wish
    my desktop were more like my cell phone!"? (And no, people are
    generally not going to know, when the zealot tells them their cell phone
    runs Linux, that he just means the base OS, and that the horrible thing
    the user interacts with and hates is just an application running on top
    of Linux).

    --
    --Tim Smith

  9. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 12:31:26 -0800, Tim Smith wrote:

    > In article ,
    > Hadron wrote:
    >> 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    >> zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    >> progress.

    >
    > Indeed. If a company decides to offer a Linux box, there is widespread
    > initial cheering, then the zealots start finding fault.
    >
    > The company picked the wrong distribution. The company isn't offering
    > enough distributions. The company said "Ubuntu" on a web page when they
    > should have said "Linux". The company said "Linux" when they should
    > have said "GNU/Linux". The Linux product page is too hard to find. The
    > price difference between the Linux box and their similar Windows boxes
    > is too low. The company should be offering a no-OS version for people
    > who want to install a different distribution. The company didn't follow
    > the GPL correctly. The company didn't offer the right video card. The
    > company is not *really* behind Linux--it is just some tactic to try to
    > Microsoft to give them a better deal on Windows, or they are offering a
    > small number of Linux systems so Microsoft can say that Microsoft
    > doesn't have a monopoly. The company is a company.
    >
    > Some random member of the public thinking about that box who does a
    > little web research will find all that crap, and that will make it seem
    > a lot safer to buy another Windows box, or maybe give Apple try.
    >
    > And then there are the zealots who use weird arguments for desktop
    > Linux. For example, some cell phones use Linux, so you should use it on
    > your desktop. Do these people live in some alternate universe where
    > people generally *like* cell phone software and go around saying "I wish
    > my desktop were more like my cell phone!"? (And no, people are
    > generally not going to know, when the zealot tells them their cell phone
    > runs Linux, that he just means the base OS, and that the horrible thing
    > the user interacts with and hates is just an application running on top
    > of Linux).


    EXCELLENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !

    Saved for future reference!

    This post should be required reading by anyone who wishes to become a Linux
    advocate.

    Read it, and then read it again because it totally, completely and
    accurately describes the current state of the Linux community.
    Not everyone, but a good portion of the people and more importantly, the
    people who are doing most of the squawking.

  10. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales


    "Hadron" wrote in message
    news:fnd3jj$or8$2@registered.motzarella.org...
    >
    > 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    > zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    > progress. Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over
    > for Linux. Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    > much doomed it would appear. Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    > invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it. I actually did
    > think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake. It simply has not
    > happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS. Whether
    > herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.
    >

    Linux has no chance last year, this year, or next year because of the simple
    fact that no one is promoting it at the scale necessary for it to show up on
    the general population's radar. Microsoft Windows is what people expect on
    a new PC. Call that herd mentality or what you will, but the marketing term
    is buyer expectation. Anything that misses the mark gets rejected until and
    unless someone comes along to convince the buyers that it is a good thing to
    buy. Linux, to-date, where it has been marketed has been marketed as a
    cheap, low-quality PC. Whatever associations people may have with Linux,
    they are not so good. It would be better to be unknown than to be classed
    as low-end as it is now.

    > MS increasing profits is not good for the most of us.
    >

    Oh it gives a lot of people a little more confidence in the future and keeps
    the world moving ahead, which is good for everyone.


  11. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    * Tim Smith peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > In article ,
    > Hadron wrote:
    >> 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    >> zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    >> progress.

    >
    > Indeed. If a company decides to offer a Linux box, there is widespread
    > initial cheering, then the zealots start finding fault.


    Don't be an idiot, Tim.

    For one thing, the complaints you post below are trivial, and most
    people know it. You're elevating some personal gripes in order to
    exaggerate their significants, and then you're tying those complaints to
    the bogus situation of zealotry.

    > The company picked the wrong distribution. The company isn't offering
    > enough distributions. The company said "Ubuntu" on a web page when they
    > should have said "Linux". The company said "Linux" when they should
    > have said "GNU/Linux". The Linux product page is too hard to find. The
    > price difference between the Linux box and their similar Windows boxes
    > is too low. The company should be offering a no-OS version for people
    > who want to install a different distribution. The company didn't follow
    > the GPL correctly. The company didn't offer the right video card. The
    > company is not *really* behind Linux--it is just some tactic to try to
    > Microsoft to give them a better deal on Windows, or they are offering a
    > small number of Linux systems so Microsoft can say that Microsoft
    > doesn't have a monopoly. The company is a company.


    In a situation with a diverse number of options and a heavily-weighted
    set of baggage, you can and will find people who, en toto, but not
    individually, moan about every aspect of a given situation.

    Big deal.

    > Some random member of the public thinking about that box who does a
    > little web research will find all that crap, and that will make it seem
    > a lot safer to buy another Windows box, or maybe give Apple try.


    Bull****.

    > And then there are the zealots who use weird arguments for desktop
    > Linux. For example, some cell phones use Linux, so you should use it on
    > your desktop. Do these people live in some alternate universe where
    > people generally *like* cell phone software and go around saying "I wish
    > my desktop were more like my cell phone!"? (And no, people are
    > generally not going to know, when the zealot tells them their cell phone
    > runs Linux, that he just means the base OS, and that the horrible thing
    > the user interacts with and hates is just an application running on top
    > of Linux).


    Now you're just pulling stuff out of your ass.

    --
    Understand that this is the last physical format there will ever be.
    -- Bill Gates, On Blu-ray. interview The Daily Princetonian (14 Oct 2005)

  12. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    * amicus_curious peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > "Hadron" wrote in message
    > news:fnd3jj$or8$2@registered.motzarella.org...
    >>
    >> 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    >> zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    >> progress. Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over
    >> for Linux. Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    >> much doomed it would appear. Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    >> invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it. I actually did
    >> think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake. It simply has not
    >> happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS. Whether
    >> herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.
    >>

    > Linux has no chance last year, this year, or next year because of the simple
    > fact that no one is promoting it at the scale necessary for it to show up on
    > the general population's radar. Microsoft Windows is what people expect on
    > a new PC. Call that herd mentality or what you will, but the marketing term
    > is buyer expectation. Anything that misses the mark gets rejected until and
    > unless someone comes along to convince the buyers that it is a good thing to
    > buy. Linux, to-date, where it has been marketed has been marketed as a
    > cheap, low-quality PC. Whatever associations people may have with Linux,
    > they are not so good. It would be better to be unknown than to be classed
    > as low-end as it is now.


    Bull****.

    You both have got some blinders on, if you really believe the Linux desktop
    isn't increasing in presence.

    --
    One who deceives will always find those who allow themselves to be deceived.
    -- Niccolo Machiavelli

  13. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    rat wrote:

    >Linux, to-date, where it has been marketed has been marketed as a
    >cheap, low-quality PC.


    You're lying again, rat. Mostly, what "marketing" Linux machines have
    gotten is for robust machines like servers.

    >Whatever associations people may have with Linux, they are not so good.


    Claims a filthy lying rat.

    >It would be better to be unknown than to be classed as low-end


    Good thing, then, that Linux is seen as a higher-performance
    alternative to Windwoes.

    >as it is now.


    You must be thinking of Visduh, which is damaging Microshaft's already
    horrible reputation for bloated, insecure operating-systems.


  14. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    Tim Smith wrote:

    >Indeed. If a company decides to offer a Linux box, there is widespread
    >initial cheering, then the zealots start finding fault.
    >
    >The company picked the wrong distribution. The company isn't offering
    >enough distributions. The company said "Ubuntu" on a web page when they
    >should have said "Linux". The company said "Linux" when they should
    >have said "GNU/Linux". The Linux product page is too hard to find. The
    >price difference between the Linux box and their similar Windows boxes
    >is too low. The company should be offering a no-OS version for people
    >who want to install a different distribution. The company didn't follow
    >the GPL correctly. The company didn't offer the right video card. The
    >company is not *really* behind Linux--it is just some tactic to try to
    >Microsoft to give them a better deal on Windows, or they are offering a
    >small number of Linux systems so Microsoft can say that Microsoft
    >doesn't have a monopoly. The company is a company.


    Funny, I hadn't noticed *any* of the above. Not that there aren't
    plenty of opinions in the world, I don't doubt that someone somewhere,
    expressed *some* of those above.

    Pretty lame, Timmy.


  15. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 16:21:31 -0500, Linonut wrote:

    > * Tim Smith peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >
    >> In article ,
    >> Hadron wrote:
    >>> 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    >>> zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    >>> progress.

    >>
    >> Indeed. If a company decides to offer a Linux box, there is widespread
    >> initial cheering, then the zealots start finding fault.

    >
    > Don't be an idiot, Tim.


    He's not.
    But certain people around here are.


    > For one thing, the complaints you post below are trivial, and most
    > people know it. You're elevating some personal gripes in order to
    > exaggerate their significants, and then you're tying those complaints to
    > the bogus situation of zealotry.


    THat's just it, they are not trivial.

    The Linux community has a huge stigma associated with it and much of it
    stems from what Tim is talking about.

    When the suit making the $$$$ decision is approaced about Linux what do you
    think he does?
    Takes a look at the net.
    There he will find more about religious Linux zealots than can fill a
    warehouse.

    He asks other suits, and they have the opinion that Linux people are
    bearded, unwashed and educated via logs and Jolt rather than on a college
    campus. I'll give Roy that one at least.
    That's great if you are desiging the next Halo game and want oddballs with
    brains to write it.
    Keep them locked up for a year or two and chances are you will have a great
    game.

    That's not good for the corporate world.


    >> The company picked the wrong distribution. The company isn't offering
    >> enough distributions. The company said "Ubuntu" on a web page when they
    >> should have said "Linux". The company said "Linux" when they should
    >> have said "GNU/Linux". The Linux product page is too hard to find. The
    >> price difference between the Linux box and their similar Windows boxes
    >> is too low. The company should be offering a no-OS version for people
    >> who want to install a different distribution. The company didn't follow
    >> the GPL correctly. The company didn't offer the right video card. The
    >> company is not *really* behind Linux--it is just some tactic to try to
    >> Microsoft to give them a better deal on Windows, or they are offering a
    >> small number of Linux systems so Microsoft can say that Microsoft
    >> doesn't have a monopoly. The company is a company.

    >
    > In a situation with a diverse number of options and a heavily-weighted
    > set of baggage, you can and will find people who, en toto, but not
    > individually, moan about every aspect of a given situation.
    >
    > Big deal.


    It is, but you are in denial.

    >
    >> Some random member of the public thinking about that box who does a
    >> little web research will find all that crap, and that will make it seem
    >> a lot safer to buy another Windows box, or maybe give Apple try.

    >
    > Bull****.


    Fact.
    Apple's Mac sales are rising.
    Linux's are flatline and still have not hit single digits on the desktop.
    You can spin it anyway you like, but those are the facts.


    >> And then there are the zealots who use weird arguments for desktop
    >> Linux. For example, some cell phones use Linux, so you should use it on
    >> your desktop. Do these people live in some alternate universe where
    >> people generally *like* cell phone software and go around saying "I wish
    >> my desktop were more like my cell phone!"? (And no, people are
    >> generally not going to know, when the zealot tells them their cell phone
    >> runs Linux, that he just means the base OS, and that the horrible thing
    >> the user interacts with and hates is just an application running on top
    >> of Linux).

    >
    > Now you're just pulling stuff out of your ass.


    No he is not.
    Look at this group.
    Pay particular attention to Kent, Schestowitz and Homer.

    Try actually READING some of the SPAm Roy sends this way.

    Tim Smith is right on target and has obviously hit a nerve.

    BTW Linonut, what has happened to you?
    Your posts used to be reasonable, but now you are like a flag waving
    zealot.

  16. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers StrongGrowth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Jan 25, 11:48 am, raylopez99 wrote:

    > > Apple is doing well... so why can't Linux?

    >
    > Could it be Apple owns its technology, and doesn't give it
    > away for free?
    > ...
    > unless somebody owns a technology, it will be misused if
    > given away for free. This is known in economics as the
    > "tragedy of the commons".


    No, it certainly is not.

    The "commons" was a grassy area in the center of some towns,
    which could be used by any citizen for grazing their cows or
    whatever. It had a finite capacity, but since it was free, people
    brought more and more cows until it was overgrazed, the grass
    was all killed, and so would no longer support any cows at all.
    That's the "tragedy of the commons" -- that a free _finite_
    resource will be rapidly exhausted due to unenlightened
    self-interest.

    But of course free open-source software is an _infinite_
    resource, because it can be duplicated indefinitely with every
    copy retaining the full functionality of the original.

    That's why the open-source software of the world community
    is such a rich resource. Every possible need for a program is
    recognized by some person or group of people somewhere
    among the world's billions, who has the time and ability to
    write it, and then shares it freely via the Internet.

    The tragedy of Microsoft is that its leaders are evil, and evil
    is stupid, and they have spent hundreds of millions of dollars
    trying to destroy the free software of the world community.
    Including the use in COLA of disinformation agents, who lack
    the intelligence to grasp concepts as simple as the tragedy of
    the commons. Microsoft has no choice but to hire such people,
    because no one with real intelligence would want to spread
    its anti-human lies.





  17. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 18:38:02 -0600, Sinister Midget wrote:

    > On 2008-01-25, Linonut claimed:
    >> * Tim Smith peremptorily fired off this memo:

    >
    >>> And then

    >
    >> Now you're just pulling stuff out of your ass.

    >
    > That's where he gets it all. Except maybe some stuff he pulls from
    > Erik's ass.


    Typical Linux advocate response.
    Why not try and discuss Tim's post?
    I know why, it's because it hurts too much because he is right on target.

  18. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers StrongGrowth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Jan 25, 11:43 am, Hadron wrote:
    > Moshe Goldfarb writes:
    > > On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 04:34:43 -0800 (PST), raylopez99 wrote:


    > Vista is a heap of **** IMO. XP is an excellent home OS when properly
    > secured.


    > 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    > zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    > progress.


    I thought it was official that Linux is sticking with GPL version 2,
    because there were too many contributors who didn't like GPL v3.

    > Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over for Linux.


    According to IDC over 230 million PCs were sold last year.
    According to Microsoft only 100 Vista Licenses were shipped.
    What were the others running?

    If Vista is less than half of the market, that means the rest is XP?

    Not exactly an overwhelming success.

    > Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    > much doomed it would appear.


    Prophets of doom have predicted the death of Linux for years, but it
    hasn't happened yet.

    End users still install Linux, even if they also use Windows.

    Linux has continued to penitrate the market in many different forms,
    and has gained acceptance for many of these forms.

    It seems like both Microsoft and Linux will thrive in spite of each
    other, or perhaps because of each other. Linux has made it's way into
    the marketplace by effectively coexisting with Windows. Users don't
    have to give up windows functionality to use Linux.

    Microsoft has experienced the benefit of Linux and OSS, which has
    provided a number of important new technologies and tools and
    offerings, even as Microsoft tries to drive traditional software
    vendors out of the business.

    > Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    > invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it.


    And now that you've had a chance to explore, you like it.

    > I actually did think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake.


    > It simply has not happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS.


    I don't think that Vista has done that well. I've been hearing from
    people that they hated it even worse than Windows ME. Thats is really
    bad news.

    > Whether herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.


    I think the big difference with Vista is that many corporations were
    prepared to make changes if they didn't like Vista, and they don't.
    Many will stick with what they are currently using, whether that is
    Windows 2000 or Windows XP. Many may be preparing to reduce their
    support levels.

    > MS increasing profits is not good for the most of us.


    The bigger problem for Microsoft is that the OEMs didn't increase
    their profits anywhere near as much. When a "partner" is experiencing
    87% growth and you are only experiencing 5% and you've been "partners"
    for almost 20 years, something is wrong with that partnership. And
    when some competitor is growing at 47% while you're growing at 5%,
    that's an even bigger problem. It's time to make some changes, and
    maybe even to reevaluate the partnership.

    And how many of Microsoft's Fortune 1000 customers are making 87%
    revenue growth? Do you really think banks want to cough up a few
    billion, like 20% of payroll, for hardware and software upgrades to
    Vista, when they are scrambling to cope with potential loan
    forclosures and defaults?

    Do you think insurance companies, other financial services companies,
    and big companies are going to want to fill Microsoft's coffers while
    they are sweating out quarter after quarter of economic constriction?

    The success of Apple shows that something new and different is wanted,
    but the pallid growth of the PC portion of Dell and HP are an
    indicator that Vista isn't what they want.

    Could Linux be the new and different that is wanted?

  19. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    Tim Smith writes:

    > In article ,
    > Hadron wrote:
    >> 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    >> zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    >> progress.

    >
    > Indeed. If a company decides to offer a Linux box, there is widespread
    > initial cheering, then the zealots start finding fault.
    >
    > The company picked the wrong distribution. The company isn't offering
    > enough distributions. The company said "Ubuntu" on a web page when they
    > should have said "Linux". The company said "Linux" when they should
    > have said "GNU/Linux". The Linux product page is too hard to find. The
    > price difference between the Linux box and their similar Windows boxes
    > is too low. The company should be offering a no-OS version for people
    > who want to install a different distribution. The company didn't follow
    > the GPL correctly. The company didn't offer the right video card. The
    > company is not *really* behind Linux--it is just some tactic to try to
    > Microsoft to give them a better deal on Windows, or they are offering a
    > small number of Linux systems so Microsoft can say that Microsoft
    > doesn't have a monopoly. The company is a company.
    >
    > Some random member of the public thinking about that box who does a
    > little web research will find all that crap, and that will make it seem
    > a lot safer to buy another Windows box, or maybe give Apple try.
    >
    > And then there are the zealots who use weird arguments for desktop
    > Linux. For example, some cell phones use Linux, so you should use it on
    > your desktop. Do these people live in some alternate universe where
    > people generally *like* cell phone software and go around saying "I wish
    > my desktop were more like my cell phone!"? (And no, people are
    > generally not going to know, when the zealot tells them their cell phone
    > runs Linux, that he just means the base OS, and that the horrible thing
    > the user interacts with and hates is just an application running on top
    > of Linux).


    Well said. And what the COLA gang dont realise is just how poorly they
    are servicing the LINUX/GNU community by doing all you said above.

    A crying shame IMO.

  20. Re: What else is new? (same old story): Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth; Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 17:43:30 +0100, Hadron wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb writes:
    >
    >> On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 04:34:43 -0800 (PST), raylopez99 wrote:
    >>
    >>> Microsoft Delivers Strong Growth and Includes a Sunny Forecast
    >>> New York Times - 9 hours ago
    >>> By STEVE LOHR Microsoft reported quarterly sales and profit gains that
    >>> surpassed Wall Street's expectations and delivered an optimistic
    >>> outlook Thursday, suggesting that a weakening economy would not slow
    >>> it down.
    >>> Microsoft Quarterly Profit Up 79% on Vista Sales Washington Post

    >>
    >> Roy seems to have missed this one in his daily news splorge.

    >
    > I find this depressing.
    >
    > Vista is a heap of **** IMO. XP is an excellent home OS when properly
    > secured.
    >
    > 2007 really could have been the year of Linux - but I am afraid the
    > zealots and the total confusion regarding the GPL is ham stringing
    > progress. Now Vista is cleaning up its act and its pretty much game over
    > for Linux. Not necessarily of OSS, but Linux as a desktop OS is pretty
    > much doomed it would appear. Too little too late. This pains me. I have
    > invested a lot of time and effort in getting used to it. I actually did
    > think 2007 would see a HUGE linux uptake. It simply has not
    > happened. People are too much in their comfort zone with MS. Whether
    > herd mentality or whatever irrelevant. It is a fact.
    >


    Exactly how has your time and effort in learning Linux been 'wasted', if
    you are satisfied with it as OS and want to use it? What MS does is
    irrelevant to that, or should be.

    --
    Kier


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