Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason tostick with Windows) - Linux

This is a discussion on Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason tostick with Windows) - Linux ; On Dec 22, 2:42*am, spi...@freenet.co.uk wrote: > DFS did eloquently scribble: > > > What's wrong with you, 7? * Did you suffer some kind of head injury a long > > time ago? *I'm dead serious. > > It's ...

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Thread: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason tostick with Windows)

  1. Re: Windopws takes many years, if not decades, to unlearn (anotherreason to stick with Linux)

    On Dec 22, 2:42*am, spi...@freenet.co.uk wrote:
    > DFS did eloquently scribble:
    >
    > > What's wrong with you, 7? * Did you suffer some kind of head injury a long
    > > time ago? *I'm dead serious.

    >
    > It's pointless considering...
    > I personally think his nickname is such because that's also his age...
    > Or was when he first started posting, so he's still a pre-teen.


    Being a pre-teen is not an excuse. None are that dumb.

  2. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reasonto stick with Windows)

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 13:23:33 +0100, Hadron wrote:

    > Au79 writes:

    (snip)
    >> Actually it was really easy to learn for me.

    >
    > What was really easy? Or are your needs turning it on, using open
    > office and turning it off?


    That is basically what using a computer is for the overwhelming number of
    people.

    --
    Rick

  3. Re: Windopws takes many years, if not decades, to unlearn (another reason to stick with Linux)

    cc did eloquently scribble:
    > On Dec 22, 2:42*am, spi...@freenet.co.uk wrote:
    >> DFS did eloquently scribble:
    >>
    >> > What's wrong with you, 7? * Did you suffer some kind of head injury a long
    >> > time ago? *I'm dead serious.

    >>
    >> It's pointless considering...
    >> I personally think his nickname is such because that's also his age...
    >> Or was when he first started posting, so he's still a pre-teen.


    > Being a pre-teen is not an excuse. None are that dumb.


    Oh yes they are, unfortunately.
    Not all of them of course, just a small minority.
    --
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    | spike1@freenet.co.uk | Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
    | | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
    |Andrew Halliwell BSc(hons)| operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
    | in |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
    | Computer Science | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

  4. Re: Windopws takes many years, if not decades, to unlearn (another reason to stick with Linux)

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 05:32:47 -0800, cc wrote:

    > On Dec 22, 2:42*am, spi...@freenet.co.uk wrote:
    >> DFS did eloquently scribble:
    >>
    >> > What's wrong with you, 7? * Did you suffer some kind of head injury a long
    >> > time ago? *I'm dead serious.

    >>
    >> It's pointless considering...
    >> I personally think his nickname is such because that's also his age...
    >> Or was when he first started posting, so he's still a pre-teen.

    >
    > Being a pre-teen is not an excuse. None are that dumb.


    Who's making excuses? 7 is an twerp who gives Linux advocacy a bad name
    whether he's seven or seventy.

    --
    Kier

  5. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    * Rick fired off this tart reply:

    > On Fri, 21 Dec 2007 08:35:35 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:
    >
    >> Another reason--of many--to stick with Windows--the steep learning
    >> curve associated with Linux.

    >
    > The learning curve is not that steep, and you know it. There is a lot of
    > knowledge that is directly transferable from Windows to Linux based
    > systems.


    The learning curve is always steep for a low-brow.

    --
    Tux rox!

  6. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reasonto stick with Windows)

    ray wrote:
    > raylopez99 wrote:
    >
    >> Let's assume that the poster Kelsey Bjarnason is correct
    >> about the wonderful capabilities of Linux. My followup
    >> question: how long does it take to learn Linux in order to
    >> do all the wonderful things outlined by Kelsey below? It
    >> took me--and keep in mind I've taken courses in rocket
    >> science--between 1 to 10 years to become really proficient
    >> in Windows (the upper bound is for stuff like programming).
    >> If I was to switch to Linux it would take me another 10
    >> years, if not more, to become proficient in Linux.
    >>
    >> Another reason--of many--to stick with Windows--the steep
    >> learning curve associated with Linux.

    >
    > Geez - I did not realize I was so intelligent. It took me only
    > a matter of a few weeks. You must really be a dolt.


    http://groups.google.com/group/comp....4b82d5feb8a11?

    | Time needed for a Windows-using high school student to
    | acclimate him or herself to the Linux desktop: 10 minutes.

    --
    HPT

  7. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reasonto stick with Windows)

    On Dec 22, 7:17*am, High Plains Thumper
    wrote:

    > > Geez - I did not realize I was so intelligent. It took me only
    > > a matter of a few weeks. You must really be a dolt.

    >
    > http://groups.google.com/group/comp....sg/7224b82d5fe...
    >
    > | Time needed for a Windows-using high school student to
    > | acclimate him or herself to the Linux desktop: 10 minutes.
    >



    Well that's either because of one of two reasons:

    (1) Linux is so easy to use that migration from Windows to Linux is
    nearly trivial--10 minutes indeed!

    (2) [more likely] the things these teens are doing with their PCs
    comprises turning the PCs on, clicking on a web browser, and surfing
    the net. So 10 minutes is arguably too long to learn to do that on a
    new OS.

    RL

  8. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 09:35:22 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:

    > On Dec 22, 7:17*am, High Plains Thumper
    > wrote:
    >
    >> > Geez - I did not realize I was so intelligent. It took me only
    >> > a matter of a few weeks. You must really be a dolt.

    >>
    >> http://groups.google.com/group/comp....sg/7224b82d5fe...
    >>
    >> | Time needed for a Windows-using high school student to
    >> | acclimate him or herself to the Linux desktop: 10 minutes.
    >>

    >
    >
    > Well that's either because of one of two reasons:
    >
    > (1) Linux is so easy to use that migration from Windows to Linux is
    > nearly trivial--10 minutes indeed!


    Ten minutes is somewhat exaggerated. Of course, to do more complex things,
    it will take longer to learn, dependig of the level of general computer
    skills a person has. But basic operations, such as most people perform
    daily, like reading mail, composing documents, browsing, listening to
    music, rippuing CDs, is simple.

    To administer, yes, it takes a while longer. But no one was born knowing
    Windows, either.

    >
    > (2) [more likely] the things these teens are doing with their PCs
    > comprises turning the PCs on, clicking on a web browser, and surfing
    > the net. So 10 minutes is arguably too long to learn to do that on a
    > new OS.
    >


    A good book such asThe Linux Pocket Guide, will get most people started.

    --
    Kier


  9. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reasonto stick with Windows)

    On Dec 22, 9:47*am, Kier wrote:
    > To administer, yes, it takes a while longer. But no one was born knowing
    > Windows, either.


    Nobody lives twice either. Why relearn the wheel when WIndows does
    everything you could possibly want?

    >
    > A good book such asThe Linux Pocket Guide, will get most people started.
    >
    > --
    > Kier


    The devil is in the details Kier. As a hobbyiest, I'm sure you mean
    well, but when I looked online at Amazon, I found two such books, by
    two different Davids (see below). Just like everything else, things
    appear easy until you actually tried to do it. Ever tried to pick up
    a pretty girl in a place like California where the competition is
    "stiff" (northern CA is worse than southern CA, fewer pretty girls in
    the former). Literally and figuratively. Or perhaps in your neck of
    the woods (London?) where the likes of you have to contend with "Fleet
    Street" or whatever equivalent of US Wall Street there is, with their
    oogles of pounds, not to mention the musclehead gym freaks from
    ****ney or whereever that work on their body and their tan all day
    long while you're stuck in the basement adminstering your Linux
    machine and tanned only by fluorescent lights. Geeky you doesn't
    stand a chance. But go for it Kier. You never know, you might get
    lucky...hahaha.

    "Thanks" (for nothing)

    RL

    Linux Pocket Guide [ILLUSTRATED] (Paperback)
    by Daniel J. Barrett (Author)
    (30 customer reviews)
    List Price: $9.95
    Price: $9.95 & eligible for FREE Super Saver Shipping on orders over
    $25. Details

    Linux Desktop Pocket Guide (Pocket Reference) by David Brickner
    (Paperback - Sep 23, 2005)
    Buy new: $9.95 50 Used & new from $1.00

  10. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 11:02:46 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:

    > On Dec 22, 9:47*am, Kier wrote:
    >> To administer, yes, it takes a while longer. But no one was born knowing
    >> Windows, either.

    >
    > Nobody lives twice either. Why relearn the wheel when WIndows does
    > everything you could possibly want?


    Why do anything? Because it's interesting, and different, a refreshing
    change from the restrictions of Windows. Or a challenge.

    Why do you troll in Linux group?

    >
    >>
    >> A good book such asThe Linux Pocket Guide, will get most people started.
    >>
    >> --
    >> Kier

    >
    > The devil is in the details Kier. As a hobbyiest, I'm sure you mean


    Most Windows are 'hobbyists' by your definition. People use PCs to write
    letters, surf, rip CDs and listen to music, most of the time. Relatively
    few who don't use it for work or who aren't techs for a living ever do
    things that are very much more coplicated. Me, I edit video, write
    fiction and do research into local history, among other things.

    > well, but when I looked online at Amazon, I found two such books, by
    > two different Davids (see below). Just like everything else, things
    > appear easy until you actually tried to do it. Ever tried to pick up
    > a pretty girl in a place like California where the competition is
    > "stiff" (northern CA is worse than southern CA, fewer pretty girls in
    > the former). Literally and figuratively. Or perhaps in your neck of
    > the woods (London?) where the likes of you have to contend with "Fleet
    > Street" or whatever equivalent of US Wall Street there is, with their
    > oogles of pounds, not to mention the musclehead gym freaks from
    > ****ney or whereever that work on their body and their tan all day
    > long while you're stuck in the basement adminstering your Linux
    > machine and tanned only by fluorescent lights. Geeky you doesn't
    > stand a chance. But go for it Kier. You never know, you might get
    > lucky...hahaha.


    Where did we get started taking about picking up girls? Hardly the same
    thing, is it? And if I'm looking to score with a girl, I don't start out
    talking about OSen, or computers, unless she's a geekess. Totally
    different skill-set.

    For all you know, I might be an Adonis. And the house I live in doesn't
    even *have* a basement, so that kind of blows away your theory, doesn't it?

    >
    > "Thanks" (for nothing)


    You ask a question, then sneer when someone answers it honestly. That
    makes you not only a troll but a dickhead. So, make up your mind, do you
    just want to be a trolling dickhead, or do you want to discuss Linux?
    Life's too short for you to be wasting it being a despicable arsehole, so
    why not try something more worthwhile?

    >
    > RL
    >
    > Linux Pocket Guide [ILLUSTRATED] (Paperback)
    > by Daniel J. Barrett (Author)
    > (30 customer reviews)
    > List Price: $9.95
    > Price: $9.95 & eligible for FREE Super Saver Shipping on orders over
    > $25. Details
    >
    > Linux Desktop Pocket Guide (Pocket Reference) by David Brickner
    > (Paperback - Sep 23, 2005)
    > Buy new: $9.95 50 Used & new from $1.00


    Good books. I have another, called 'The Linux Phrasebook', which is of a
    similar kind, v. useful, clear and concise, and 'Linux in a Nutshell', a
    bit harder-core for a beginner, but still invaluable. Also, the 'Debian
    Cookbook', great for all distros that are Debian-based.

    --
    Kier


  11. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 09:35:22 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:

    > On Dec 22, 7:17*am, High Plains Thumper
    > wrote:
    >
    >> > Geez - I did not realize I was so intelligent. It took me only
    >> > a matter of a few weeks. You must really be a dolt.

    >>
    >> http://groups.google.com/group/comp....sg/7224b82d5fe...
    >>
    >> | Time needed for a Windows-using high school student to
    >> | acclimate him or herself to the Linux desktop: 10 minutes.
    >>

    >
    >
    > Well that's either because of one of two reasons:
    >
    > (1) Linux is so easy to use that migration from Windows to Linux is
    > nearly trivial--10 minutes indeed!
    >
    > (2) [more likely] the things these teens are doing with their PCs
    > comprises turning the PCs on, clicking on a web browser, and surfing
    > the net. So 10 minutes is arguably too long to learn to do that on a
    > new OS.
    >
    > RL


    FWIW - we have about 300 library patrons who have made the switch from MS
    to Linux without any guidance or warning. Zero complaints in nearly three
    years of operation.


  12. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    Hadron wrote:
    > ray writes:


    >> FWIW - we have about 300 library patrons who have made the switch
    >> from MS to Linux without any guidance or warning. Zero complaints in
    >> nearly three years of operation.

    >
    > Library story ++. What is it now? 20,000 times?


    He seems to have quit saying he installed them - now he just tells about
    them.

    6-9 Linux systems in a library, and he talks about it several hundred times.
    Strange.

    ray, you need to get one of those '100 Things To Do When I Retire' list.
    Put 'Install Linux at the local library' as #1, then scratch it off and move
    on.




  13. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 21:19:03 +0100, Hadron wrote:

    > ray writes:
    >
    >> On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 09:35:22 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Dec 22, 7:17*am, High Plains Thumper
    >>> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> > Geez - I did not realize I was so intelligent. It took me only
    >>>> > a matter of a few weeks. You must really be a dolt.
    >>>>
    >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/comp....sg/7224b82d5fe...
    >>>>
    >>>> | Time needed for a Windows-using high school student to
    >>>> | acclimate him or herself to the Linux desktop: 10 minutes.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> Well that's either because of one of two reasons:
    >>>
    >>> (1) Linux is so easy to use that migration from Windows to Linux is
    >>> nearly trivial--10 minutes indeed!
    >>>
    >>> (2) [more likely] the things these teens are doing with their PCs
    >>> comprises turning the PCs on, clicking on a web browser, and surfing
    >>> the net. So 10 minutes is arguably too long to learn to do that on a
    >>> new OS.
    >>>
    >>> RL

    >>
    >> FWIW - we have about 300 library patrons who have made the switch from MS
    >> to Linux without any guidance or warning. Zero complaints in nearly three
    >> years of operation.
    >>

    >
    > Library story ++. What is it now? 20,000 times?
    >
    > Come off it Ray, it's almost certainly just a bespoke interface to a
    > book catalog or a web browser. Nothing to learn. Point and click and use
    > a keyboard. THEY are not administering multimedia, X or whatever.


    Actually it is nine public access internet computers. They use them for
    what you use them for. No, they are not administering multimedia - I
    didn't know that was the point of this thread. They browse the internet,
    download and print pdf and other document files, play online games,
    compose documents, etc. Just exactly what 95% of people at home do with
    their computers.


  14. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 16:07:22 -0500, DFS wrote:

    > Hadron wrote:
    >> ray writes:

    >
    >>> FWIW - we have about 300 library patrons who have made the switch
    >>> from MS to Linux without any guidance or warning. Zero complaints in
    >>> nearly three years of operation.

    >>
    >> Library story ++. What is it now? 20,000 times?

    >
    > He seems to have quit saying he installed them - now he just tells about
    > them.


    Yes, as a matter of fact, I did.

    >
    > 6-9 Linux systems in a library, and he talks about it several hundred times.
    > Strange.


    The library has eleven public access internet computers - nine run Linux
    and there is one xp and one vista machine - is that terribly difficult to
    comprehend?

    >
    > ray, you need to get one of those '100 Things To Do When I Retire' list.
    > Put 'Install Linux at the local library' as #1, then scratch it off and move
    > on.


    That was not on my list of things to do when I retired - which was about
    three and a half years ago - it just came along. However, I have indeed
    done several of the things which were on my list. I have moved on -
    however it seems to make an excellent point from time to time, so, yes I
    bring it up as an example. What is the problem there?

  15. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 15:50:03 -0700, ray wrote:

    > On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 21:19:03 +0100, Hadron wrote:
    >
    >> ray writes:
    >>
    >>> On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 09:35:22 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Dec 22, 7:17*am, High Plains Thumper
    >>>> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> > Geez - I did not realize I was so intelligent. It took me only
    >>>>> > a matter of a few weeks. You must really be a dolt.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/comp....sg/7224b82d5fe...
    >>>>>
    >>>>> | Time needed for a Windows-using high school student to
    >>>>> | acclimate him or herself to the Linux desktop: 10 minutes.
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Well that's either because of one of two reasons:
    >>>>
    >>>> (1) Linux is so easy to use that migration from Windows to Linux is
    >>>> nearly trivial--10 minutes indeed!
    >>>>
    >>>> (2) [more likely] the things these teens are doing with their PCs
    >>>> comprises turning the PCs on, clicking on a web browser, and surfing
    >>>> the net. So 10 minutes is arguably too long to learn to do that on a
    >>>> new OS.
    >>>>
    >>>> RL
    >>>
    >>> FWIW - we have about 300 library patrons who have made the switch from MS
    >>> to Linux without any guidance or warning. Zero complaints in nearly three
    >>> years of operation.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Library story ++. What is it now? 20,000 times?
    >>
    >> Come off it Ray, it's almost certainly just a bespoke interface to a
    >> book catalog or a web browser. Nothing to learn. Point and click and use
    >> a keyboard. THEY are not administering multimedia, X or whatever.

    >
    > Actually it is nine public access internet computers. They use them for
    > what you use them for. No, they are not administering multimedia - I
    > didn't know that was the point of this thread. They browse the internet,
    > download and print pdf and other document files, play online games,
    > compose documents, etc. Just exactly what 95% of people at home do with
    > their computers.


    Hadron's just being his usual arsehole self. He claims he wants to now
    what other COLA regs have done for OSS - but when you tell him you've done
    something really useful, he whines and sneers.

    --
    Kier


  16. Re: Linux takes many years {Pfffft!}

    On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 22:53:32 +0000, Kier wrote:

    > On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 15:50:03 -0700, ray wrote:
    >
    >> On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 21:19:03 +0100, Hadron wrote:
    >>
    >>> ray writes:
    >>>
    >>>> On Sat, 22 Dec 2007 09:35:22 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> On Dec 22, 7:17*am, High Plains Thumper
    >>>>> wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> > Geez - I did not realize I was so intelligent. It took me only a
    >>>>>> > matter of a few weeks. You must really be a dolt.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/

    msg/7224b82d5fe...
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> | Time needed for a Windows-using high school student to |
    >>>>>> acclimate him or herself to the Linux desktop: 10 minutes.


    ....about right...

    >>>>>
    >>>>> Well that's either because of one of two reasons:
    >>>>>
    >>>>> (1) Linux is so easy to use that migration from Windows to Linux is
    >>>>> nearly trivial--10 minutes indeed!


    Pretty close. I was out of the box to on-line from a fresh install (Ubu
    6.04 at the time) in about 20 minutes. It took me about 10 minutes, and
    one pass over the help guide to understand the file structure and how to
    use it. More technical issues waited until later; but, I think I may
    have poured a whole 6 hours into learning Ubuntu and Linux -- in over 10
    months of constant use. Its now my preferred OS. Yeah, I'd say its
    pretty easy to learn.

    {snip}

    Cheers;

    Ed
    --
    History is three men in a room agreeing to a lie.

  17. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    On 2007-12-22, Linonut claimed:
    > * Rick fired off this tart reply:
    >
    >> On Fri, 21 Dec 2007 08:35:35 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:
    >>
    >>> Another reason--of many--to stick with Windows--the steep learning
    >>> curve associated with Linux.

    >>
    >> The learning curve is not that steep, and you know it. There is a lot of
    >> knowledge that is directly transferable from Windows to Linux based
    >> systems.

    >
    > The learning curve is always steep for a low-brow.


    Or a unibrow.

    --
    I do more work all day than some people do before 5 AM.

  18. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    Sinister Midget wrote:

    > On 2007-12-22, Gregory Shearman claimed:
    >
    >> Programming is the same on any platform, so you won't have to learn
    >> that. Therefore you would probably be proficient after one year.

    >
    > Gosh you're optimistic! Maybe you're right about the average person.


    Proficient maybe, expert no.

    > But raydopez??


    He can't even install it, let alone use it. He's a ****ing drongo.

    --
    Regards,

    Gregory.
    Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power

  19. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reason to stick with Windows)

    Hadron wrote:

    > Sinister Midget writes:
    >
    >> On 2007-12-22, Gregory Shearman claimed:
    >>
    >>> Programming is the same on any platform, so you won't have to learn
    >>> that. Therefore you would probably be proficient after one year.

    >>
    >> Gosh you're optimistic! Maybe you're right about the average person.
    >> But raydopez??

    >
    > "programming" is not "the same" on every platform. It is true that good
    > programmer will adapt relatively quickly. It is vastly different in many
    > cases. Tools are different, the IDEs you must use (corporate policy) can
    > be different and unless you are familiar with a cross platform API and
    > are allowed to use it then APIs are different too.


    Jesus Quark. I've programmed in C on MS-DOS, VAX/VMS and Linux. IDE? Who
    needs 'em? Tools? An editor and a compiler, the same on all platforms.

    --
    Regards,

    Gregory.
    Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power

  20. Re: Linux takes many years, if not decades, to lern (another reasonto stick with Windows)

    On Dec 23, 3:25*am, Gregory Shearman wrote:
    > Jesus Quark. I've programmed in C on MS-DOS, VAX/VMS and Linux. IDE? Who
    > needs 'em? Tools? An editor and a compiler, the same on all platforms. *
    >
    >


    C is a good language when dealing with a strange OS like Linux. For
    the rest of us, we prefer something a little more user-friendly, like
    Visual Studio.

    Good luck to you.

    RL

    Kier--which book of the *three* are you now recommending? I still
    can't get a straight answer out of you.


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