PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs - Linux

This is a discussion on PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs - Linux ; On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:49:20 -0400, Bob Campbell wrote: > "Rick" wrote in message > news:13uvr79h8u6283@news.supernews.com... > >> IIRC, "PC" refers to IBM Personal Computer, as in IBM PC compatible, >> not as in personal computer. > > Exactly, ...

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Thread: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

  1. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:49:20 -0400, Bob Campbell wrote:

    > "Rick" wrote in message
    > news:13uvr79h8u6283@news.supernews.com...
    >
    >> IIRC, "PC" refers to IBM Personal Computer, as in IBM PC compatible,
    >> not as in personal computer.

    >
    > Exactly, and Macs are now "PC Compatible", since they use the same CPUs,
    > motherboards and chipsets as every other "PC" out there.
    >
    >>Can Windows now be installed on a Mac without
    >> Boot Camp? Can Windows be installed directly on the metal?

    >
    > Vista 64 probably can, since it can use EFI to boot instead of BIOS.


    I'm not that familiar with Vista. Can Vista 32 use EFI?

    >
    > But even using BootCamp, Windows is "installed directly on the metal".
    > BootCamp is just a disk partitioner/BIOS substitute. There is no
    > hardware emulation going on, like running in VMWare or something.


    There is a BIOS substitution going on.



    --
    Rick

  2. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    "Rick" wrote in message
    news:13uvrsdgmsblc90@news.supernews.com...
    >> Vista 64 probably can, since it can use EFI to boot instead of BIOS.

    >
    > I'm not that familiar with Vista. Can Vista 32 use EFI?


    I don't think so, but I'm not 100% sure. Some Yahooing would turn up the
    answer.

    >> But even using BootCamp, Windows is "installed directly on the metal".
    >> BootCamp is just a disk partitioner/BIOS substitute. There is no
    >> hardware emulation going on, like running in VMWare or something.

    >
    > There is a BIOS substitution going on.


    But that's just to get it to boot. Once it's booted, it is "running on the
    metal" - no emulated video cards or other fake hardware. You are running
    100% full speed of the hardware.

    Basically the same thing happens in the other direction also. EFI is faked
    on a "PC" so OS X can boot on it. After that, OS X is "running on the
    metal".


  3. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    Dick Hurtz wrote:
    >
    >
    > "Hasta La Vista" wrote in message
    > news:N6adnfQ-qvVPDnLanZ2dnUVZ_s6mnZ2d@comcast.com...
    >>
    >> "Cork Soaker" wrote in message
    >> news:fso1t7$fas$1@registered.motzarella.org...
    >>>
    >>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>> news:0001HW.C41255EC0001325BF01846D8@news.comcast. net...
    >>> : On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 03:30:30 -0700, Cork Soaker wrote
    >>> : (in article ):
    >>> :
    >>> : > O x f o r d wrote:
    >>> : >
    >>> : >> Learn what MAC means... hint: there is no computer called a MAC.
    >>> : >
    >>> : > Wow, you must be twelve years old.
    >>> :
    >>> : He has a point. MAC is an acronym for Media Access Control, while
    >>> an Apple
    >>> : Computer is called a Mac -short for Macintosh.
    >>> :
    >>>
    >>> We all know.

    >>
    >> There was a time when Macintosh meant something more than simply
    >> Apple's name on the outside of the computer.
    >>
    >> All this thread says is that the PCs Apple builds run Vista faster
    >> than do PCs from Dell, HP, Acer, etc. A strange accolade coming from
    >> those who also call Vista a POS and a failure.

    >
    >
    > Part of that is probably because some PC OEM's insist on loading up new
    > computers with useless, resource hogging crapware. Sony is the worst
    > offender. Thankfully they're starting to listen to their customers and
    > you can order a new computer crapware-free. Vista on a Mac is just a
    > clean store bough copy of Vista - no crapware. No surprise that it runs
    > faster.


    For tetsing all systems would be installed form scratch with no
    crapware. And just a few systems were in that test where the MacBook
    Pro came out slightly ahead (which could easily have been fixed for
    shock value and free publicity).

    Steve

  4. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    Rick wrote:
    > On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:27:46 -0400, Bob Campbell wrote:
    >
    >> "Dick Hurtz" wrote in message
    >> news5GdnaIVDtTzXXLanZ2dnUVZ_uCinZ2d@comcast.com...
    >>>> Part of that is probably because some PC OEM's insist on loading up
    >>>> new
    >>> computers with useless, resource hogging crapware. Sony is the worst
    >>> offender. Thankfully they're starting to listen to their customers and
    >>> you can order a new computer crapware-free. Vista on a Mac is just a
    >>> clean store bough copy of Vista - no crapware. No surprise that it runs
    >>> faster. It has nothing to do with Apple's overpriced hardware, which is
    >>> no different that what Dell, Lenovo, or anyone else is selling. They
    >>> just charge their suckers more for it.

    >> Yep. Plus this whole thread is misnamed anyways. Macs ARE PCs. PCs
    >> ARE Macs. They are the same now. "Macs" can run Vista, and "PCs" can
    >> run OS X.

    >
    > IIRC, "PC" refers to IBM Personal Computer, as in IBM PC compatible, not
    > as in personal computer. Can Windows now be installed on a Mac without
    > Boot Camp? Can Windows be installed directly on the metal?


    Yes, on any Apple made after April 2007, or earlier ones with the EFI
    update. BootCamp had no part in making Apple Intel Macs able to boot
    and run Windows.

    Steve

  5. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    Bob Campbell wrote:

    >
    >> Can Windows now be installed on a Mac without
    >> Boot Camp? Can Windows be installed directly on the metal?

    >
    > Vista 64 probably can, since it can use EFI to boot instead of BIOS.


    Vista 64 doesn't use EFI to boot. SP1 was supposed to add EFI - UEFI
    2.0 support in particular, which isn't compatible with Apple's older
    version. And I am not sure that even made it to SP1.

    > But even using BootCamp, Windows is "installed directly on the metal".
    > BootCamp is just a disk partitioner/BIOS substitute.


    BootCamp is not a "BIOS substitute" and plays no part in allowing an
    Intel Mac to boot Windows. All Intel Macs since like April 2006 have
    come with BIOS emulation builtin, and a firmware update brought that
    capability to earlier Apple Intel Macs.

    Steve

  6. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    Hasta La Vista wrote:
    > All this thread says is that the PCs Apple builds run Vista faster than
    > do PCs from Dell, HP, Acer, etc. A strange accolade coming from those
    > who also call Vista a POS and a failure.


    Right, it tells me something critical to my whole existence:
    that some brand of Mac is the absolute fastest way of doing
    something I can't imagine EVER wanting to do.

    More useful to me is the fact that some brand of Mac is the
    _only_ way to do something I _do_ want to do.

    --
    Wes Groleau

    I've noticed lately that the paranoid fear of computers becoming
    intelligent and taking over the world has almost entirely disappeared
    from the common culture. Near as I can tell, this coincides with
    the release of MS-DOS.
    -- Larry DeLuca

  7. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    Wes Groleau wrote:
    > Hasta La Vista wrote:
    >> All this thread says is that the PCs Apple builds run Vista faster
    >> than do PCs from Dell, HP, Acer, etc. A strange accolade coming from
    >> those who also call Vista a POS and a failure.

    >
    > Right, it tells me something critical to my whole existence:
    > that some brand of Mac is the absolute fastest way of doing
    > something I can't imagine EVER wanting to do.


    Not the "absolute fastest". Just the fastest of the small subset of
    available laptops they tested. And you also have to believe they
    didn't bump the test score for PR purposes.

    Steve

  8. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    Steve de Mena wrote:
    > Not the "absolute fastest". Just the fastest of the small subset of
    > available laptops they tested. And you also have to believe they didn't
    > bump the test score for PR purposes.


    I don't have to believe that. In fact, it's VERY unlikely
    that they lied. They'd be shown as fools within hours.

    On the other hand, it's not so unlikely that they omitted
    from the test machines that wouldn't be as fast as they wanted.

    Either way, who cares? Ability to run Vista is not likely
    to ever sell a computer to me.

    --
    Wes Groleau

    There are more Baroque musicians than any other kind.

  9. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    On 2008-03-28, Gordon wrote:
    > "Cork Soaker" wrote in message
    > news:fsihc4$9re$1@registered.motzarella.org...
    >>O x f o r d wrote:
    >>
    >>> Learn what MAC means... hint: there is no computer called a MAC.

    >>
    >> Wow, you must be twelve years old.

    >
    >
    > Well mine's called FRED......


    Mine are called frankie and riffraff.

    Those are just the Macs. The other non-Macs have other names...

    --
    NO! There are no CODICILES of Fight Club! |||
    / | \
    That way leads to lawyers and business megacorps and credit cards!

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  10. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    On 2008-03-30, Dick Hurtz wrote:
    >
    >
    > "Hasta La Vista" wrote in message
    > news:N6adnfQ-qvVPDnLanZ2dnUVZ_s6mnZ2d@comcast.com...
    >>
    >> "Cork Soaker" wrote in message
    >> news:fso1t7$fas$1@registered.motzarella.org...
    >>>
    >>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>> news:0001HW.C41255EC0001325BF01846D8@news.comcast. net...
    >>> : On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 03:30:30 -0700, Cork Soaker wrote
    >>> : (in article ):
    >>> :
    >>> : > O x f o r d wrote:
    >>> : >
    >>> : >> Learn what MAC means... hint: there is no computer called a MAC.
    >>> : >
    >>> : > Wow, you must be twelve years old.
    >>> :
    >>> : He has a point. MAC is an acronym for Media Access Control, while an
    >>> Apple
    >>> : Computer is called a Mac -short for Macintosh.
    >>> :
    >>>
    >>> We all know.

    >>
    >> There was a time when Macintosh meant something more than simply Apple's
    >> name on the outside of the computer.
    >>
    >> All this thread says is that the PCs Apple builds run Vista faster than do
    >> PCs from Dell, HP, Acer, etc. A strange accolade coming from those who
    >> also call Vista a POS and a failure.

    >
    >
    > Part of that is probably because some PC OEM's insist on loading up new
    > computers with useless, resource hogging crapware. Sony is the worst
    > offender. Thankfully they're starting to listen to their customers and you


    Not only that but they also tend to put the crappiest components in
    that they can find. Apple seems to manage to be just one step above that.
    At least for the minis they seem to use the "one step up from the bottom"
    rule.

    So I could definitely see the lowend Macs having a better price
    performance ratio than similar PC vendors.

    > can order a new computer crapware-free. Vista on a Mac is just a clean store
    > bough copy of Vista - no crapware. No surprise that it runs faster. It has
    > nothing to do with Apple's overpriced hardware, which is no different that
    > what Dell, Lenovo, or anyone else is selling. They just charge their suckers
    > more for it.
    >



    --
    NO! There are no CODICILES of Fight Club! |||
    / | \
    That way leads to lawyers and business megacorps and credit cards!

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  11. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    On 2008-03-30, Rick wrote:
    > On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:27:46 -0400, Bob Campbell wrote:
    >
    >> "Dick Hurtz" wrote in message
    >> news5GdnaIVDtTzXXLanZ2dnUVZ_uCinZ2d@comcast.com...
    >>>> Part of that is probably because some PC OEM's insist on loading up
    >>>> new
    >>> computers with useless, resource hogging crapware. Sony is the worst
    >>> offender. Thankfully they're starting to listen to their customers and
    >>> you can order a new computer crapware-free. Vista on a Mac is just a
    >>> clean store bough copy of Vista - no crapware. No surprise that it runs
    >>> faster. It has nothing to do with Apple's overpriced hardware, which is
    >>> no different that what Dell, Lenovo, or anyone else is selling. They
    >>> just charge their suckers more for it.

    >>
    >> Yep. Plus this whole thread is misnamed anyways. Macs ARE PCs. PCs
    >> ARE Macs. They are the same now. "Macs" can run Vista, and "PCs" can
    >> run OS X.

    >
    > IIRC, "PC" refers to IBM Personal Computer, as in IBM PC compatible, not
    > as in personal computer. Can Windows now be installed on a Mac without
    > Boot Camp? Can Windows be installed directly on the metal?


    Just startup the system with the OS installation disk and
    reconfigure the partitions and boot type.

    --
    NO! There are no CODICILES of Fight Club! |||
    / | \
    That way leads to lawyers and business megacorps and credit cards!

    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
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  12. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs



    "Wes Groleau" wrote in message
    news:65XHj.8143$p97.5093@trnddc03...
    > Steve de Mena wrote:
    >> Not the "absolute fastest". Just the fastest of the small subset of
    >> available laptops they tested. And you also have to believe they didn't
    >> bump the test score for PR purposes.

    >
    > I don't have to believe that. In fact, it's VERY unlikely
    > that they lied. They'd be shown as fools within hours.
    >
    > On the other hand, it's not so unlikely that they omitted
    > from the test machines that wouldn't be as fast as they wanted.
    >
    > Either way, who cares? Ability to run Vista is not likely
    > to ever sell a computer to me.


    The only people that care are the COLA nuts.. they think that one PC running
    faster than another is a problem for M$ that they can exploit in their petty
    war against choice. When M$ start making PCs they may be correct, but until
    then its all bullsh!t.




  13. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    dumbass@home wrote:

    >The only people that care are the COLA nuts.. they think that one PC running
    >faster than another is a problem for M$ that they can exploit in their petty
    >war against choice. When M$ start making PCs they may be correct, but until
    >then its all bullsh!t.


    Are you enjoying flaunting your ignorance, dumbass?


  14. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs



    "chrisv" wrote in message
    news:8fa4v31ak17359el95l6f9fuk27suroj0m@4ax.com...
    > dumbass@home wrote:
    >
    >>The only people that care are the COLA nuts.. they think that one PC
    >>running
    >>faster than another is a problem for M$ that they can exploit in their
    >>petty
    >>war against choice. When M$ start making PCs they may be correct, but
    >>until
    >>then its all bullsh!t.

    >
    > Are you enjoying flaunting your ignorance, dumbass?
    >


    So you are too stupid to comprehend and its someone else's fault.
    Ask Frank to explain it to you if you are that stupid.


  15. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs

    dumbass@home wrote:

    >"chrisv" wrote in message
    >>
    >> dumbass@home wrote:
    >>>
    >>>The only people that care are the COLA nuts.. they think that one PC
    >>>running
    >>>faster than another is a problem for M$ that they can exploit in their
    >>>petty
    >>>war against choice. When M$ start making PCs they may be correct, but
    >>>until
    >>>then its all bullsh!t.

    >>
    >> Are you enjoying flaunting your ignorance, dumbass?

    >
    >So you are too stupid to comprehend and its someone else's fault.
    >Ask Frank to explain it to you if you are that stupid.


    Nice incoherent froth, dumbass. Maybe you should learn about commas.
    It would also be nice if you would learn how to post a message without
    mangling what you quote.

    P.S. Fake any MD5 sums lately, dumbass?


  16. Re: PCWorld: Macs run Vista faster than PCs



    "chrisv" wrote in message
    news:uef4v39crbog44mu9e6ij1s8pcdp6r2pea@4ax.com...
    > dumbass@home wrote:
    >
    >>"chrisv" wrote in message
    >>>
    >>> dumbass@home wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>The only people that care are the COLA nuts.. they think that one PC
    >>>>running
    >>>>faster than another is a problem for M$ that they can exploit in their
    >>>>petty
    >>>>war against choice. When M$ start making PCs they may be correct, but
    >>>>until
    >>>>then its all bullsh!t.
    >>>
    >>> Are you enjoying flaunting your ignorance, dumbass?

    >>
    >>So you are too stupid to comprehend and its someone else's fault.
    >>Ask Frank to explain it to you if you are that stupid.

    >
    > Nice incoherent froth, dumbass. Maybe you should learn about commas.
    > It would also be nice if you would learn how to post a message without
    > mangling what you quote.
    >
    > P.S. Fake any MD5 sums lately, dumbass?
    >


    Do you want to prove it can't be
    done,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,a
    few spare commas for you to insert where they belong.

    You lot really like to bring linux down to your level don't you.
    I expect real linux folk love you.


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