Re: <plug> Disaster Recovery, ASP hosting and MPE OS support - case study #1 - Hewlett Packard

This is a discussion on Re: <plug> Disaster Recovery, ASP hosting and MPE OS support - case study #1 - Hewlett Packard ; Quoting Paul Raulerson: "Sure- that's what we have mean, nasty, hungry lawyers for of course. And we own our building, which conveys different kinds of rights." and "Still, a natural disaster is way different that some city goofballs kicking you ...

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Thread: Re: <plug> Disaster Recovery, ASP hosting and MPE OS support - case study #1

  1. Re: <plug> Disaster Recovery, ASP hosting and MPE OS support - case study #1

    Quoting Paul Raulerson:

    "Sure- that's what we have mean, nasty, hungry lawyers for of course. And
    we own our building, which conveys different kinds of rights."

    and

    "Still, a natural disaster is way different that some city goofballs kicking
    you out of your building. That kind of nonsense would NOT have been
    tolerated here. The nutcases who tried to pull something like that would
    have been eagle meat - so long as the eagles have passed their bar exams and
    like raw meat. "

    Paul:

    I think you missed some points or details... remember I said " Everyone in
    the building, including several state agencies" - one of those state
    agencies was the Office of the Attorney General of the particular state. For
    the record, it wasn't "city goofballs" kicking people out of the building -
    it was the fire marshal and the health department (city and state health
    departments, actually). The fire marshal and health departments have the
    legal authority to condemn buildings as unfit for human occupation, and that
    holds in every state in the United States, including Texas, the Independent
    Enclave of Austin and the District of Columbia.

    Owning the building does not confer any special rights to continue to occupy
    the building when the fire marshall and health department have restricted or
    prohibited access - the building owner's office was in this building too -
    they were thrown out with all the tenants.

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  2. Re: <plug> Disaster Recovery, ASP hosting and MPE OS support - case study #1

    On Oct 17, 2008, at 11:15 PM, Matthew Perdue wrote:

    > Quoting Paul Raulerson:
    >
    > "Sure- that's what we have mean, nasty, hungry lawyers for of
    > course. And
    > we own our building, which conveys different kinds of rights."
    >
    > and
    >
    > "Still, a natural disaster is way different that some city goofballs
    > kicking
    > you out of your building. That kind of nonsense would NOT have been
    > tolerated here. The nutcases who tried to pull something like that
    > would
    > have been eagle meat - so long as the eagles have passed their bar
    > exams and
    > like raw meat. "
    >
    > Paul:
    >
    > I think you missed some points or details... remember I said "
    > Everyone in
    > the building, including several state agencies" - one of those state
    > agencies was the Office of the Attorney General of the particular
    > state. For
    > the record, it wasn't "city goofballs" kicking people out of the
    > building -
    > it was the fire marshal and the health department (city and state
    > health
    > departments, actually). The fire marshal and health departments have
    > the
    > legal authority to condemn buildings as unfit for human occupation,
    > and that
    > holds in every state in the United States, including Texas, the
    > Independent
    > Enclave of Austin and the District of Columbia.
    >


    You said that no-one was allowed to go into the building because there
    was no water in the building.

    That would not have stood in court here in Austin for even 15 minutes,
    and in fact there was a case here where just such a silly ruling did
    NOT stand. So yes, in my opinion, it was "city goofballs" who pulled
    that stunt, and I'm not particularly impressed by whatever titles
    those goofballs may have held. As I said, that is my opinion, YMMV.
    I'm even willing to be convinced otherwise.

    At the worst, an alternative solution of porta-potties and a source of
    potable water could have been a proposed as a workable compromise.

    These kinds of horror stories do not usually serve to help companies
    manage risk better, they serve to inspire FUD. While true, they are
    not normal situations, nor at least in this case, are they always
    situations that were inevitable.

    You want a horror story? In my day job, all of our X86 capacity is
    handled by IBM BladeServers. We use an expensive product called
    Christie Bare Metal Restore to ensure we can slap a working Windows
    image of any particular server back onto DASD storage in minutes. All
    of this is a design that I involved IBM in when I did it. The thinking
    was that we could contract with IBM for DR services for a limited
    period of time until we build out more and additional data centers.

    IBM Equipment, IBM DR. Should be a perfect match, eh? The IBM DR
    center came back and told me the Christie BMR would not work,
    because.... the class of servers we needed to use in their data center
    consisted of HP 1u/2u servers. Racked up nicely of course. (*sigh*)

    They have since corrected that situation, but that is the kind of
    nonsense we run into from vendors, even the very BIG vendors.
    The "common wisdom" is either to spend much precious time reloading
    Windows on different machines, or else build out a DR center with
    duplicates of the equipment you use in your other data centers. Not
    very smart choices in either case.

    What I would like to see is discussion on smart alternatives to
    spending millions of dollars on DR sites that are not really used
    unless there is a disaster event.

    One of the smartest ideas I have ever seen in this whole area is what
    HP is doing with their data centers; the "six pack" data center
    structure they are building. That is smart, cost effective, and very
    very capable of handling enormous surges in capacity.

    We need something like that in the SMB sector.

    And yes, this is a bit of a hot button with me. Mostly because it is a
    simple issue that has been made complex, and the common wisdom on this
    subject is just that - common. I want to find all the uncommon
    wisdome; the stuff where people have come up with *better* ideas.



    > Owning the building does not confer any special rights to continue
    > to occupy
    > the building when the fire marshall and health department have
    > restricted or
    > prohibited access - the building owner's office was in this building
    > too -
    > they were thrown out with all the tenants.
    >


    Ownership always conveys special rights. Sometimes you simply have to
    fight harder for them.


    > * To join/leave the list, search archives, change list settings, *
    > * etc., please visit http://raven.utc.edu/archives/hp3000-l.html *


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