Is it technically possible to build a flash version of Emu48 in
Actionscript 3.0 ?
julien
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Is it technically possible to build a flash version of Emu48 in
Actionscript 3.0 ?
julien
On Jul 18, 6:03*am, Julien MEYER <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=blue]
> Is it technically possible to build a flash version of Emu48 *in
> Actionscript 3.0 ?
>
> julien[/color]
ECMA script is a Turing-complete language so a Flash or JavaScript
implementation of any program is theoretically possible. That said,
Flash has significant overhead, and so any such implementation is
likely to be unbearably slow, and have unreasonable memory
requirements. Further, there is of course no reliable way to translate
existing program to ActionScript, so the program would need to be
rewritten from scratch in ActionScript.
So while it is technically possible, the results would be almost
completely unusable, and it would take way to much effort to seriously
consider.
username localhost a écrit :[color=blue]
> On Jul 18, 6:03 am, Julien MEYER <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=green]
>> Is it technically possible to build a flash version of Emu48 in
>> Actionscript 3.0 ?
>>
>> julien[/color]
>
> ECMA script is a Turing-complete language so a Flash or JavaScript
> implementation of any program is theoretically possible. That said,
> Flash has significant overhead, and so any such implementation is
> likely to be unbearably slow, and have unreasonable memory
> requirements. Further, there is of course no reliable way to translate
> existing program to ActionScript, so the program would need to be
> rewritten from scratch in ActionScript.
>
> So while it is technically possible, the results would be almost
> completely unusable, and it would take way to much effort to seriously
> consider.[/color]
Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu :
[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url]
Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)
julien
On Jul 18, 12:39*pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=blue]
> username localhost a écrit :
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> >> julien[/color][/color]
> Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu :[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url]
>
> Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)
>
> julien[/color]
Hmm... interesting. It seems there is less overhead than I might
think. I also keep forgetting that the processor on the hp-48 is only
2 MHz, and the memory is also quite limited.
A suppose such an emulator might not be unusable, but it would still
most likely take a significant amount of work.
username localhost a écrit :[color=blue]
> On Jul 18, 12:39 pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=green]
>> username localhost a écrit :
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> julien[/color]
>> Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu :[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url]
>>
>> Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)
>>
>> julien[/color]
>
> Hmm... interesting. It seems there is less overhead than I might
> think. I also keep forgetting that the processor on the hp-48 is only
> 2 MHz, and the memory is also quite limited.
>
> A suppose such an emulator might not be unusable, but it would still
> most likely take a significant amount of work.[/color]
Definitly yes.
Claus, one of the two authors of this great C64 flash emu, answer my
mail back and he is asking me for some HP48 specs. Thank you very much
Claus!
Claus said :
[color=blue]
>I don't know the exact specs of that calculator, so i can't really
>answer that question. Emulating a 2 MHz processor in Flash shouldn't
>be a problem, but i could imagine that emulating the FPU could be
>challenging.
>
>Do you have detailed specs for the HP48, and the firmware?
>
>Cheers,
>Claus.[/color]
So, what is the best spec files available out there? I can't imagine
what might happen if we could give him something interesting to read!
--
Cheers,
julien
[url]http://jadegame.com/hp/smhpsrc/[/url] - SuperMarioHP in asm with sources.
username localhost a écrit :[color=blue]
> On Jul 18, 12:39 pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=green]
>> username localhost a écrit :
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> julien[/color]
>> Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu :[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url]
>>
>> Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)
>>
>> julien[/color]
>
> Hmm... interesting. It seems there is less overhead than I might
> think. I also keep forgetting that the processor on the hp-48 is only
> 2 MHz, and the memory is also quite limited.
>
> A suppose such an emulator might not be unusable, but it would still
> most likely take a significant amount of work.[/color]
Definitly yes.
Claus, one of the two authors of this great C64 flash emu, answer my
mail back and he is asking me for some HP48 specs. Thank you very much
Claus!
Claus said :
[color=blue]
>I don't know the exact specs of that calculator, so i can't really
>answer that question. Emulating a 2 MHz processor in Flash shouldn't
>be a problem, but i could imagine that emulating the FPU could be
>challenging.
>
>Do you have detailed specs for the HP48, and the firmware?
>
>Cheers,
>Claus.[/color]
So, what is the best spec files available out there? I can't imagine
what might happen if we could give him something interesting to read!
--
Cheers,
julien
[url]http://jadegame.com/hp/smhpsrc/[/url] - SuperMarioHP in asm with sources.
username localhost a écrit :[color=blue]
> On Jul 18, 12:39 pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=green]
>> username localhost a écrit :
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> julien[/color]
>> Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu :[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url]
>>
>> Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)
>>
>> julien[/color]
>
> Hmm... interesting. It seems there is less overhead than I might
> think. I also keep forgetting that the processor on the hp-48 is only
> 2 MHz, and the memory is also quite limited.
>
> A suppose such an emulator might not be unusable, but it would still
> most likely take a significant amount of work.[/color]
Definitly yes.
Claus, one of the two authors of this great C64 flash emu, answer my
mail back and he is asking me for some HP48 specs. Thank you very much
Claus!
Claus said :
[color=blue]
>I don't know the exact specs of that calculator, so i can't really
>answer that question. Emulating a 2 MHz processor in Flash shouldn't
>be a problem, but i could imagine that emulating the FPU could be
>challenging.
>
>Do you have detailed specs for the HP48, and the firmware?
>
>Cheers,
>Claus.[/color]
So, what is the best spec files available out there? I can't imagine
what might happen if we could give him something interesting to read!
--
Cheers,
julien
[url]http://jadegame.com/hp/smhpsrc/[/url] - SuperMarioHP in asm with sources.
Oops sorry for sending tree times the same thread, my vpn has got some
troubles ;)
Julien MEYER a écrit :[color=blue]
> username localhost a écrit :[color=green]
>> On Jul 18, 12:39 pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> username localhost a écrit :
>>>
>>>>> julien
>>> Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu
>>> :[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url]
>>>
>>> Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)
>>>
>>> julien[/color]
>>
>> Hmm... interesting. It seems there is less overhead than I might
>> think. I also keep forgetting that the processor on the hp-48 is only
>> 2 MHz, and the memory is also quite limited.
>>
>> A suppose such an emulator might not be unusable, but it would still
>> most likely take a significant amount of work.[/color]
>
>
> Definitly yes.
>
> Claus, one of the two authors of this great C64 flash emu, answer my
> mail back and he is asking me for some HP48 specs. Thank you very much
> Claus!
>
> Claus said :
>[color=green]
> >I don't know the exact specs of that calculator, so i can't really
> >answer that question. Emulating a 2 MHz processor in Flash shouldn't
> >be a problem, but i could imagine that emulating the FPU could be
> >challenging.
> >
> >Do you have detailed specs for the HP48, and the firmware?
> >
> >Cheers,
> >Claus.[/color]
>
> So, what is the best spec files available out there? I can't imagine
> what might happen if we could give him something interesting to read!
>
> --
> Cheers,
> julien
>
> [url]http://jadegame.com/hp/smhpsrc/[/url] - SuperMarioHP in asm with sources.[/color]
"username localhost" <username.localhost@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:cc53fe18-419f-4a7a-aefc-872439f04bb5@e53g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
On Jul 18, 12:39 pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=blue]
> username localhost a écrit :
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> >> julien[/color][/color]
> Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu
> :[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url]
>
> Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)
>
> julien[/color]
[color=blue]
>Hmm... interesting. It seems there is less overhead than I might
>think. I also keep forgetting that the processor on the hp-48 is only
>2 MHz, and the memory is also quite limited.
>[/color]
Ahem, the 48G+ or GX has a CPU clock of nearly 4MHz,
whereas the C64 only has around 1MHz (PAL: 0.98 NTSC: 1.02)
The ROM of the 48G+/GX is 512KiB, and RAM can be up
to somewhat more than 4MB, using bank switching.
Not really limited in relation to the C64 with its 20KiB ROM and 64KiB
RAM;-)
[color=blue]
>A suppose such an emulator might not be unusable, but it would still
>most likely take a significant amount of work.
>[/color]
I think a re-implementation of Emu48 (or similar) in actionscript (shudder)
might only be of academic interest.
It's like re-inventing the wheel, but with much more unnecessary overhead
than the existing solutions, like Emu48 for Win32 or x48 for nux,
where at least Emu48 for Win32 also is somewhat performant.
On Jul 18, 2:38*pm, Julien MEYER <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=blue]
> username localhost a écrit :[/color]
[color=blue]
> So, what is the best spec files available out there? I can't imagine
> what might happen if we could give him something interesting to read![/color]
Saturn Intro: [url]http://www.hpmuseum.org/saturn.htm[/url]
EMU48 Source: [url]http://hp.giesselink.com/Emu48/E48SP47.ZIP[/url]
IMHO I think Flash would be a waste of time. If you want to port
EMU48 to browsers, then Java may be a better platform. It runs just
about everywhere, whereas Flash does not. A Java version could run
standalone or in a browser.
On Jul 18, 6:29*pm, "dataj...@gmail.com" <dataj...@gmail.com> wrote:[color=blue]
> Saturn Intro: *[url]http://www.hpmuseum.org/saturn.htm[/url]
>
> EMU48 Source: *[url]http://hp.giesselink.com/Emu48/E48SP47.ZIP[/url]
>
> IMHO I think Flash would be a waste of time. *If you want to port
> EMU48 to browsers, then Java may be a better platform. *It runs just
> about everywhere, whereas Flash does not. *A Java version could run
> standalone or in a browser.[/color]
You may want to take a look at the Adobe AIR runtime:
[url]http://www.adobe.com/products/air/[/url]
Your statement that Java "runs just about everywhere, whereas Flash
does not" is of course debatable.
Cheers,
Claus (co-author of FC64).
Raymond Del Tondo a écrit :[color=blue]
> "username localhost" <username.localhost@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:cc53fe18-419f-4a7a-aefc-872439f04bb5@e53g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> On Jul 18, 12:39 pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=green]
>> username localhost a écrit :
>>[color=darkred]
>>>> julien[/color]
>> Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu
>> :[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url]
>>
>> Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)
>>
>> julien[/color]
>[color=green]
>> Hmm... interesting. It seems there is less overhead than I might
>> think. I also keep forgetting that the processor on the hp-48 is only
>> 2 MHz, and the memory is also quite limited.
>>[/color]
> Ahem, the 48G+ or GX has a CPU clock of nearly 4MHz,
> whereas the C64 only has around 1MHz (PAL: 0.98 NTSC: 1.02)
> The ROM of the 48G+/GX is 512KiB, and RAM can be up
> to somewhat more than 4MB, using bank switching.
>
> Not really limited in relation to the C64 with its 20KiB ROM and 64KiB
> RAM;-)
>
>[color=green]
>> A suppose such an emulator might not be unusable, but it would still
>> most likely take a significant amount of work.
>>[/color]
> I think a re-implementation of Emu48 (or similar) in actionscript (shudder)
> might only be of academic interest.
>
> It's like re-inventing the wheel, but with much more unnecessary overhead
> than the existing solutions, like Emu48 for Win32 or x48 for nux,
> where at least Emu48 for Win32 also is somewhat performant.
>
>[/color]
Well,
Correct me if i'm wrong but I think this project is a great opportunity
to push the entire HP48 apps base into the WEB, in a fresh flash based
cool way, then to touch millions users rather than just a few geeks ;-)
I think the interest is capital and might be a real HP opportunity to
sell more calculators..
Cheers,
julien
[email]datajerk@gmail.com[/email] a écrit :[color=blue]
> On Jul 18, 2:38 pm, Julien MEYER <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=green]
>> username localhost a écrit :[/color]
>[color=green]
>> So, what is the best spec files available out there? I can't imagine
>> what might happen if we could give him something interesting to read![/color]
>
> Saturn Intro: [url]http://www.hpmuseum.org/saturn.htm[/url]
>
> EMU48 Source: [url]http://hp.giesselink.com/Emu48/E48SP47.ZIP[/url]
>
> IMHO I think Flash would be a waste of time. If you want to port
> EMU48 to browsers, then Java may be a better platform. It runs just
> about everywhere, whereas Flash does not. A Java version could run
> standalone or in a browser.[/color]
Adobe AIR could also run stand alone.... Flash and java are both ECMA
languages, but I'd prefer flash not because it owns 99,9999 % of the
market client side, while Java is more powerful server side, because
Flash9 has the best RIA framework to build rich internet applications;)
julien
[email]datajerk@gmail.com[/email] a écrit :[color=blue]
> On Jul 18, 2:38 pm, Julien MEYER <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=green]
>> username localhost a écrit :[/color]
>[color=green]
>> So, what is the best spec files available out there? I can't imagine
>> what might happen if we could give him something interesting to read![/color]
>
> Saturn Intro: [url]http://www.hpmuseum.org/saturn.htm[/url]
>
> EMU48 Source: [url]http://hp.giesselink.com/Emu48/E48SP47.ZIP[/url]
>
> IMHO I think Flash would be a waste of time. If you want to port
> EMU48 to browsers, then Java may be a better platform. It runs just
> about everywhere, whereas Flash does not. A Java version could run
> standalone or in a browser.[/color]
Thanks,
I just past the links to him. Hope this helps!
Cheers,
julien
Claus Wahlers a écrit :[color=blue]
> On Jul 18, 6:29 pm, "dataj...@gmail.com" <dataj...@gmail.com> wrote:[color=green]
>> Saturn Intro: [url]http://www.hpmuseum.org/saturn.htm[/url]
>>
>> EMU48 Source: [url]http://hp.giesselink.com/Emu48/E48SP47.ZIP[/url]
>>
>> IMHO I think Flash would be a waste of time. If you want to port
>> EMU48 to browsers, then Java may be a better platform. It runs just
>> about everywhere, whereas Flash does not. A Java version could run
>> standalone or in a browser.[/color]
>
> You may want to take a look at the Adobe AIR runtime:
> [url]http://www.adobe.com/products/air/[/url]
>
> Your statement that Java "runs just about everywhere, whereas Flash
> does not" is of course debatable.
>
> Cheers,
> Claus (co-author of FC64).[/color]
Welcome Claus, thank you for joining us here !
julien
On Jul 18, 3:47*pm, Claus Wahlers <cl...@codeazur.com.br> wrote:[color=blue]
> On Jul 18, 6:29*pm, "dataj...@gmail.com" <dataj...@gmail.com> wrote:[/color]
[color=blue]
> Your statement that Java "runs just about everywhere, whereas Flash
> does not" is of course debatable.[/color]
Java is more ubiquitous. It runs on all my platforms, whereas Flash
does not. E.g. my Zaurus PDA, my (soon to be replaced with iPhone 3G)
Windows 5.0 Smart phone. Granted there are options becoming
available, but they tend to lag behind browser plugin support. E.g.
not every Flash supported device may support Flash 9.
I am not stating that one is technically better than the other, just
that Java is more widespread, more mature and may be a better global
platform for a calculator emulator.
On Jul 18, 4:03*pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:[color=blue]
> dataj...@gmail.com a écrit :
> Adobe AIR could also run stand alone.... Flash and java are both ECMA
> languages, but I'd prefer flash not because it owns 99,9999 % of the
> market client side, while Java is more powerful server side, because
> Flash9 has the best RIA framework to build rich internet applications;)[/color]
No question Flash won over Java for browser-based client side
applications. As for 99.9999% I will not argue that. Almost every
web page I visit has Flash on it. It has become so cumbersome and
such a drag on system performance that I installed the Firefox Flash
blocker. :-)
If you port EMU48 to Flash (or Java), you will have takers, no doubt,
good luck.
On Jul 18, 5:07*pm, "Raymond Del Tondo" <Ih8...@nowhere.com> wrote:[color=blue]
> "username localhost" <username.localh...@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitragnews:cc53fe18-419f-4a7a-aefc-872439f04bb5@e53g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> On Jul 18, 12:39 pm, Julien Meyer <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>[color=green]
> > username localhost a écrit :[/color]
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> > >> julien[/color]
> > Not sure it will be too slow, have a look at this Commodore64 emu
> > :[url]http://osflash.org/fc64/[/url][/color]
>[color=green]
> > Hope sebc is reading me, a flash emu48 might be so cool to play with ;)[/color]
>[color=green]
> > julien
> >Hmm... interesting. It seems there is less overhead than I might
> >think. I also keep forgetting that the processor on the hp-48 is only
> >2 MHz, and the memory is also quite limited.[/color]
>
> Ahem, the 48G+ or GX has a CPU clock of nearly 4MHz,
> whereas the C64 only has around 1MHz (PAL: 0.98 NTSC: 1.02)
> The ROM of the 48G+/GX is 512KiB, and RAM can be up
> to somewhat more than 4MB, using bank switching.
>
> Not really limited in relation to the C64 with its 20KiB ROM and 64KiB
> RAM;-)
>[color=green]
> >A suppose such an emulator might not be unusable, but it would still
> >most likely take a significant amount of work.[/color]
>
> I think a re-implementation of Emu48 (or similar) in actionscript (shudder)
> might only be of academic interest.
>
> It's like re-inventing the wheel, but with much more unnecessary overhead
> than the existing solutions, like Emu48 for Win32 or x48 for nux,
> where at least Emu48 for Win32 also is somewhat performant.[/color]
Keep in mind that the ActionScript 3.0 language is simply an extended
version of the ECMAscript language, much like Mozilla Foundation's
JavaScript. (I'm not sure if it is MoCo or MoFo that is maintaining
the Javascript language, but since MoFo owns MoCo it really does not
matter).
Specifically, Javascript 2 will support ActionScript 3.0's class
notation, type specification notation, access package system, void
keyword, default function parameters, and likely some other features.
Javascript 2.0 might not support AS 3.0's event model, however, that
is not a terribly large problem. as will be explained later.
Thus to port an AS 3.0 app to Javascript 2.0 would require replacing
any interface code. This is not surprising. A browsers DOM is quite
different from the interface model of Flash. More specifically, any
use of objects from the runtime.flash package will likely need to be
replaced with an equivalent that uses browser features. And that is
the main reason why it does not matter if JavaScript 2.0 supports the
AS 3.0 event model. The primary use of AS 3.0's event model are the
flash specific packages. since those could not be used in a web page,
they don't matter. If the core code uses the model internally, I
believe that can be supported simply by extending the Javascript
Object prototype.
Thus a practical matter, Porting from AS 3.0 to Javascript 2.0 will
mean writing a new user-interface for the core. A much smaller task
than writing and testing the core itself.
A JS 2.0 hp-48 emulator is certainly an very interesting concept.