Rechargeables vs Alkalines. - Hewlett Packard

This is a discussion on Rechargeables vs Alkalines. - Hewlett Packard ; The rechargeables that I have now are AAA Duracell 1.2V 1000mAh and I have a 15 minute charger to go along with them. After reading previous posts, I know that they have super quick discharge and the low battery sign ...

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  1. Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    The rechargeables that I have now are AAA Duracell 1.2V 1000mAh and I
    have a 15 minute charger to go along with them. After reading previous
    posts, I know that they have super quick discharge and the low battery
    sign comes on fast. Should I just change these rechargeables every
    time the sign appears or should I wait until the calculator completely
    dies? Will changing them when the sign comes up reduce my battery
    life?

    Also, is there anyway to reprogram the calc ( I don't know what I'm
    talking about) so that the battery sign is in tune with the
    rechargeables? I don't want the sign to come on after a couple hours
    of use.

    Thanks.


  2. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 11:00:20 -0700, "DVHS.Student@gmail.com"
    wrote:

    >The rechargeables that I have now are AAA Duracell 1.2V 1000mAh and I
    >have a 15 minute charger to go along with them. After reading previous
    >posts, I know that they have super quick discharge and the low battery
    >sign comes on fast. Should I just change these rechargeables every
    >time the sign appears or should I wait until the calculator completely
    >dies? Will changing them when the sign comes up reduce my battery
    >life?


    WHAT batteries? There are rechargeable NiCd, MiMH and rechargeable
    alkaline. Plus some more exotic. "Duracell" says nothing. Different
    types have dirrerent requirements regarding charging/discharging cycle

    Educate yourself. Start fro the link I gave you in previous post,. Use
    Google.

    A.L.

  3. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Aug 2, 11:06 am, A.L. wrote:
    > On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 11:00:20 -0700, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"
    >
    > wrote:
    > >The rechargeables that I have now are AAA Duracell 1.2V 1000mAh and I
    > >have a 15 minute charger to go along with them. After reading previous
    > >posts, I know that they have super quick discharge and the low battery
    > >sign comes on fast. Should I just change these rechargeables every
    > >time the sign appears or should I wait until the calculator completely
    > >dies? Will changing them when the sign comes up reduce my battery
    > >life?

    >
    > WHAT batteries? There are rechargeable NiCd, MiMH and rechargeable
    > alkaline. Plus some more exotic. "Duracell" says nothing. Different
    > types have dirrerent requirements regarding charging/discharging cycle
    >
    > Educate yourself. Start fro the link I gave you in previous post,. Use
    > Google.
    >
    > A.L.


    oh I have NiMH batteries AAA/HR03/DC2400/1.2V


  4. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 12:59:02 -0700, "DVHS.Student@gmail.com"
    wrote:

    >
    >oh I have NiMH batteries AAA/HR03/DC2400/1.2V


    OK, I took fresh NiMH battery, set my battery tester to "alkaline" and
    chedked the recharegable. Tester was on boundary beween red ("good")
    and yellow ("80% discharged")

    A.L.

  5. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Aug 2, 1:10 pm, A.L. wrote:
    > On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 12:59:02 -0700, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"
    >
    > wrote:
    >
    > >oh I have NiMH batteries AAA/HR03/DC2400/1.2V

    >
    > OK, I took fresh NiMH battery, set my battery tester to "alkaline" and
    > chedked the recharegable. Tester was on boundary beween red ("good")
    > and yellow ("80% discharged")
    >
    > A.L.


    So does that mean it will function almost as properly as a regular non-
    rechargeable alkaline battery? However, doesn't the Voltage drop fast?
    It is 1.2V , 0.3 V lower than regular alkalines. Mabye that is the
    only problem? I'm guessing from all of the posts I've searched through
    that the calculator only detects the voltage level?


  6. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 13:28:32 -0700, "DVHS.Student@gmail.com"
    wrote:

    >On Aug 2, 1:10 pm, A.L. wrote:
    >> On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 12:59:02 -0700, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"
    >>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >> >oh I have NiMH batteries AAA/HR03/DC2400/1.2V

    >>
    >> OK, I took fresh NiMH battery, set my battery tester to "alkaline" and
    >> chedked the recharegable. Tester was on boundary beween red ("good")
    >> and yellow ("80% discharged")
    >>
    >> A.L.

    >
    >So does that mean it will function almost as properly as a regular non-
    >rechargeable alkaline battery? However, doesn't the Voltage drop fast?
    >It is 1.2V , 0.3 V lower than regular alkalines. Mabye that is the
    >only problem? I'm guessing from all of the posts I've searched through
    >that the calculator only detects the voltage level?


    Simple experiment: a) put alkalines, b) replace alkalines by NiMH

    If in case a) you don't have low battery sign, and in case b) you do,
    then this will be the proof that your calculator doens't like NiMH

    A.L.

  7. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    DVHS.Student@gmail.com wrote:
    > On Aug 2, 1:10 pm, A.L. wrote:
    >> On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 12:59:02 -0700, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"
    >>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>> oh I have NiMH batteries AAA/HR03/DC2400/1.2V

    >> OK, I took fresh NiMH battery, set my battery tester to "alkaline" and
    >> chedked the recharegable. Tester was on boundary beween red ("good")
    >> and yellow ("80% discharged")
    >>
    >> A.L.

    >
    > So does that mean it will function almost as properly as a regular non-
    > rechargeable alkaline battery? However, doesn't the Voltage drop fast?
    > It is 1.2V , 0.3 V lower than regular alkalines. Mabye that is the
    > only problem? I'm guessing from all of the posts I've searched through
    > that the calculator only detects the voltage level?
    >


    that's correct.
    BTW have you read this one?
    http://groups.google.com/group/comp....272faa0529a8b2 "(...)
    I generally just run it [50g] until it powers itself off before
    replacing the batteries. I've never yet lost any memory."

  8. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Aug 2, 2:58 pm, mats wrote:
    > DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com wrote:
    > > On Aug 2, 1:10 pm, A.L. wrote:
    > >> On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 12:59:02 -0700, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"

    >
    > >> wrote:

    >
    > >>> oh I have NiMH batteries AAA/HR03/DC2400/1.2V
    > >> OK, I took fresh NiMH battery, set my battery tester to "alkaline" and
    > >> chedked the recharegable. Tester was on boundary beween red ("good")
    > >> and yellow ("80% discharged")

    >
    > >> A.L.

    >
    > > So does that mean it will function almost as properly as a regular non-
    > > rechargeable alkaline battery? However, doesn't the Voltage drop fast?
    > > It is 1.2V , 0.3 V lower than regular alkalines. Mabye that is the
    > > only problem? I'm guessing from all of the posts I've searched through
    > > that the calculator only detects the voltage level?

    >
    > that's correct.
    > BTW have you read this one?http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.hp48/msg/c4272faa0529a8b2"(...)
    > I generally just run it [50g] until it powers itself off before
    > replacing the batteries. I've never yet lost any memory."- Hide quoted text -
    >
    > - Show quoted text -


    Are you sure you can do that? Even if the calculator does erase
    memory, it cannot erase the SYSTEM memory right? I mean, when you guys
    talk about "losing memory," does that only mean the VARs that you have
    self-stored. If you lose your memory, you will basically return to the
    "default calculator" right?


  9. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    DVHS.Student@gmail.com wrote:
    > On Aug 2, 2:58 pm, mats wrote:
    >> BTW have you read this one?http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.hp48/msg/c4272faa0529a8b2"(...)
    >> I generally just run it [50g] until it powers itself off before
    >> replacing the batteries. I've never yet lost any memory."

    >
    > Are you sure you can do that? Even if the calculator does erase
    > memory, it cannot erase the SYSTEM memory right? I mean, when you guys
    > talk about "losing memory," does that only mean the VARs that you have
    > self-stored. If you lose your memory, you will basically return to the
    > "default calculator" right?
    >


    yes I'm sure (also, TW is quite a good source of info and you've got
    the idea of "losing memory". The calc has so called flash memory (Port
    2, call it SYSTEM memory) that won't get lost and volatile RAM for your
    "VARs" (Port 0 - you'll see this numbers in the File Manager
    [LS][APPS]). This portion of the calc's memory can get lost (but hey,
    you can make backups of your VARs to an SD-Card, your PC or even to the
    before mentioned flash memory, look for the ARCHIVE command or try
    Conn4x). But RAM is backed up by the "CR2032 back up battery [which] is
    included in the calculator to provide power backup to volatile memory
    when changing the main batteries" (citing for you again the "User's
    Guide" p. 26-9).
    you could try out all this by yourself to assure we aren't telling you
    bs First make a backup of your calc if you want to preserve anything,
    and then start your experiments! Nothing can go wrong and you'll get a
    better understanding of what's going on with that smart machine:-)

    Have fun!

  10. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    You might want to switch to the newer low self discharge NIMH cells
    Ray-O-Vac, Sanyo (eneloop), Kodak, just about everyone is offering
    these new technology cells. It looks like you lose some charge
    capacity, 2000 vs 2600 for AA, but I have not noticed that much loss
    of the charge rate in my camera flash. They may be less apt to give
    away charge capacity due to internal resistance or other internal
    gremlins. Also remember that a fast charger may shut off at 80% of
    full charge capacity. Check your specific charger to see if it quits
    at "full" or trickle charges for an hour or two to top off the cells.
    If it stops, get a small slow charger to finish them off.

    I have had the best results to date with Duracell PowerPix cells. They
    are not rechargeable but are nickel-oxy type cells like Panasonic
    oxyrides. They are lithium like with a higher voltage (1.7) but three
    weeks of using them about five-eight hours per week and the battery
    monitor is still at 100%. I've had new in box alkalines show 93% fresh
    out of the package.



  11. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Aug 2, 11:00 am, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"
    wrote:
    > The rechargeables that I have now are AAA Duracell 1.2V 1000mAh and I
    > have a 15 minute charger to go along with them. After reading previous
    > posts, I know that they have super quick discharge and the low battery
    > sign comes on fast. Should I just change these rechargeables every
    > time the sign appears or should I wait until the calculator completely
    > dies? Will changing them when the sign comes up reduce my battery
    > life?
    >
    > Also, is there anyway to reprogram the calc ( I don't know what I'm
    > talking about) so that the battery sign is in tune with the
    > rechargeables? I don't want the sign to come on after a couple hours
    > of use.
    >
    > Thanks.


    I've heard it suggested to never charge the batteries so quickly. Do
    your batteries get pretty warm after a 15-minute fast charge? I'm
    almost guessing now that your batteries are not indeed getting fully
    charged. Rather, they are getting too hot and the temperature sensor
    is shutting down the charge ahead of time.

    Heat will kill these beasts fast. I don't usually push my AAAs with
    more than 200-300 mA (800-900 mAh capacity, or about C/3). They take
    slightly longer to charge, but I'm under the impression that they'll
    last longer.

    As mentioned before, with the new "hybrid" batteries, it's not (to me)
    as necessary to have a 15-minute charge, as replacement cells are
    somewhat handy.

    To save yourself some grief in the long term, may I suggest getting a
    quality 1-hour (or longer) charger? I truly believe you will have a
    lot fewer issues, but this is just my take on the situation.

    Good luck; I hope you find an answer. I don't believe it's the
    calculator

    Regards,
    Scott


  12. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    If it is a timer charger it may not be charging the AAA cells to full
    capacity. They usually derate the charge rate for AAA and the time is
    usually for charging two cells, not four. I use a Maha 204 charger for
    small cells that has a "fast mode" of 200-300 mah, not fast but the
    cells stay happy. Dynex (Best Buy's house brand) and Energizer's 15
    minute charger usuaslly do a good job of rapidly charging to a higher
    capacity without cooking the cells, they have a fan in them. There is
    a Duracell charger that has four independent channels with a LED
    status monitor for each channel. It does a decent job as well. I call
    it decent if cells don't get too hot to touch when fully charged.

    I had one Duracell charger 15 or 30 minute, Can't recall, if the cells
    were not making good contact with a metal band at the - end of the
    cell, they would overheat as that was the temperature sense strip.


  13. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Aug 2, 11:00 am, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"
    wrote:
    > The rechargeables that I have now are AAA Duracell 1.2V 1000mAh and I
    > have a 15 minute charger to go along with them. After reading previous
    > posts, I know that they have super quick discharge and the low battery
    > sign comes on fast. Should I just change these rechargeables every
    > time the sign appears or should I wait until the calculator completely
    > dies? Will changing them when the sign comes up reduce my battery
    > life?
    >
    > Also, is there anyway to reprogram the calc ( I don't know what I'm
    > talking about) so that the battery sign is in tune with the
    > rechargeables? I don't want the sign to come on after a couple hours
    > of use.
    >
    > Thanks.


    Just some anecdotal evidence:

    I got a 49G+ over a year ago (Upgraded from an 18 year old 28S I
    bought new and couldn't be happier. Zero screen or keyboard problems.)
    and I've been keeping track of battery usage (yes, I'm that anal). I
    got 54 days usage out of the hp supplied AAA alkaline batteries. I
    replaced them with your Duracell AAA 1.2V 1000mAh NiMH batteries and
    got 99 days out of them. I recharged them and got another 265 days
    usage out of them.

    I replaced/charged the batteries as soon as the low battery indicator
    came on (which looks like WiFi level indicator, so I still have to
    think about what it means, every time I see it - must be an
    Austrailian thing). The first two battery sets represent heavy use and
    a lot of playing with an 512MB SD card. The third was more mundane day-
    to-day usage. Curiously, I got better battery life out of the
    rechargeables than I did the Alkalines. (It was made in 2005, maybe
    they discharged in the package.)

    My old charger would only charge batteries in pairs and I lost my
    fourth AAA sometime in the last 3 or 4 months, so I had to buy 4 more
    AAAs. Luckily, I found a Duracell charger that will let you charge 1,
    2, 3, or 4 batteries at a time (model CEF21NC for a whopping $25). A
    real boon for 49G+ users with an odd number of batteries. I can take
    over 8 hours for a full charge (AAs charge much faster than AAAs), but
    now that I have two sets of batteries, that's not a problem (well
    that, and 4 AAs I didn't need that came with the charger).

    At least I don't have to track down those weird little half-AAA things
    that the 28S uses anymore (which uses three at a time, but are only
    sold in pairs - naturally).

    Hope this helps,

    Scott Kitts


  14. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On 5 ago, 19:34, Scott Kitts wrote:
    > On Aug 2, 11:00 am, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"
    > wrote:
    >
    > > The rechargeables that I have now are AAA Duracell 1.2V 1000mAh and I
    > > have a 15 minute charger to go along with them. After reading previous
    > > posts, I know that they have super quick discharge and the low battery
    > > sign comes on fast. Should I just change these rechargeables every
    > > time the sign appears or should I wait until the calculator completely
    > > dies? Will changing them when the sign comes up reduce my battery
    > > life?

    >
    > > Also, is there anyway to reprogram the calc ( I don't know what I'm
    > > talking about) so that the battery sign is in tune with the
    > > rechargeables? I don't want the sign to come on after a couple hours
    > > of use.

    >
    > > Thanks.

    >
    > Just some anecdotal evidence:
    >
    > I got a 49G+ over a year ago (Upgraded from an 18 year old 28S I
    > bought new and couldn't be happier. Zero screen or keyboard problems.)
    > and I've been keeping track of battery usage (yes, I'm that anal). I
    > got 54 days usage out of the hp supplied AAA alkaline batteries. I
    > replaced them with your Duracell AAA 1.2V 1000mAh NiMH batteries and
    > got 99 days out of them. I recharged them and got another 265 days
    > usage out of them.
    >
    > I replaced/charged the batteries as soon as the low battery indicator
    > came on (which looks like WiFi level indicator, so I still have to
    > think about what it means, every time I see it - must be an
    > Austrailian thing). The first two battery sets represent heavy use and
    > a lot of playing with an 512MB SD card. The third was more mundane day-
    > to-day usage. Curiously, I got better battery life out of the
    > rechargeables than I did the Alkalines. (It was made in 2005, maybe
    > they discharged in the package.)
    >
    > My old charger would only charge batteries in pairs and I lost my
    > fourth AAA sometime in the last 3 or 4 months, so I had to buy 4 more
    > AAAs. Luckily, I found a Duracell charger that will let you charge 1,
    > 2, 3, or 4 batteries at a time (model CEF21NC for a whopping $25). A
    > real boon for 49G+ users with an odd number of batteries. I can take
    > over 8 hours for a full charge (AAs charge much faster than AAAs), but
    > now that I have two sets of batteries, that's not a problem (well
    > that, and 4 AAs I didn't need that came with the charger).
    >
    > At least I don't have to track down those weird little half-AAA things
    > that the 28S uses anymore (which uses three at a time, but are only
    > sold in pairs - naturally).
    >
    > Hope this helps,
    >
    > Scott Kitts


    I do use Alkalines becouse it`s more healty for the calc... i`m
    talking about 50g... but i`ve extended its lifetime in 2 months
    becouse i frecuently use mi calc conected to an iPod USB Adaptor...


  15. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    Just to remind you folks:
    1)
    Alkalines: Voltage starts from ~1,5V and drops steadily =>
    easy to predict battery life
    2)
    NiMH: ~1,2V, immediately drops a little
    then STAYS at ~1,2V
    until at the end sharply drops down the voltage

    Keep replacements with you!
    VPN
    PS:
    You may consider new Lion 1,5V batteries...
    Anyone to test those?

    wrote in message
    news:1186086512.133655.99260@i13g2000prf.googlegro ups.com...
    > On Aug 2, 1:10 pm, A.L. wrote:
    >> On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 12:59:02 -0700, "DVHS.Stud...@gmail.com"
    >>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >> >oh I have NiMH batteries AAA/HR03/DC2400/1.2V

    >>
    >> OK, I took fresh NiMH battery, set my battery tester to "alkaline" and
    >> chedked the recharegable. Tester was on boundary beween red ("good")
    >> and yellow ("80% discharged")
    >>
    >> A.L.

    >
    > So does that mean it will function almost as properly as a regular non-
    > rechargeable alkaline battery? However, doesn't the Voltage drop fast?
    > It is 1.2V , 0.3 V lower than regular alkalines. Mabye that is the
    > only problem? I'm guessing from all of the posts I've searched through
    > that the calculator only detects the voltage level?
    >




  16. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Mar 27, 6:18 am, "Veli-Pekka Nousiainen"
    wrote:
    > You may consider new Lion 1,5V batteries...
    > Anyone to test those?


    From Energizier's spec sheet for their lithium AAA battery:
    http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/l92.pdf

    It looks like it drops off faster than an alkaline. Comparing to
    their NiMH, though, the drop is not so dramatic at the end.
    (energizer nimh: http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/nh12-900.pdf )

    Keep in mind though, that at the maximum current draw of a calculator,
    the lithium will only last ~30% longer than an alkaline. The gain
    diminishes at lower (typical) current draw (to about zero gain during
    normal calculations). The benefit from the lithium is their lower
    internal resistance, which is important for high drain devices.

    -Jonathan

  17. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    "bokubob" wrote in message
    news:dcbf49e1-3f41-4d26-bb10-d8a04c30d929@x41g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
    X
    The benefit from the lithium is their lower
    > internal resistance, which is important for high drain devices.
    >


    Thanks!
    What is high drain (if not the 50g)??



  18. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    On Mar 27, 8:54 pm, "Veli-Pekka Nousiainen"
    wrote:
    > What is high drain (if not the 50g)??


    Digital cameras, especially the flash, are notoriously high drain.
    Reading out the CCD constantly doesn't help either.
    :-)

    -Jonathan

  19. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    I mean >100mA
    or what?
    Is it just ~high drain (another "hard fact" down the drain...)
    ???

    "bokubob" wrote in message
    news:a8bd8cea-fe7d-459e-b689-9bb70e6f5fa9@i29g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
    > On Mar 27, 8:54 pm, "Veli-Pekka Nousiainen"
    > wrote:
    >> What is high drain (if not the 50g)??

    >
    > Digital cameras, especially the flash, are notoriously high drain.
    > Reading out the CCD constantly doesn't help either.
    > :-)
    >
    > -Jonathan




  20. Re: Rechargeables vs Alkalines.

    Veli-Pekka Nousiainen wrote:

    > I mean >100mA or what?


    "high" or "low" drain usually refers to a load relative to the battery's
    capacity. A common value is a load > 1 CA, i.e. the battery's capacity
    divided by 1 hour. Example: 1500 mAh battery => 1500 mA load.

    Some figures: a high power flashgun (e.g. Metz 45-series) is able to
    draw more than 10 Amperes from a decent NiCd-battery-pack for a short
    moment right after the flash is fired. AC-adaptors for digital cameras
    are usually rated for currents around 2 Amperes. Finally you might want
    ask someone who's building RC-cars and similar stuff about what he would
    consider a "high drain" application - he probably will add another zero
    to the previous figures. Yes, *left* of the decimal point. <8)

    In other words: if the battery is able to run a device longer than about
    one hour, it's not a "high drain" device. <8)

    Dieter


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