The HP 35S has arrived... - Hewlett Packard

This is a discussion on The HP 35S has arrived... - Hewlett Packard ; Where is the P->R and R->P? wrote in message news:1180390796.945800.239040@i13g2000prf.googlegr oups.com... > The new HP35S (the HP 35 35th anniversary model) has arrived: > http://www.calculators-hp.com/35s.html > > and it looks supurb! > > Dave. >...

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Thread: The HP 35S has arrived...

  1. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    Where is the P->R and R->P?




    wrote in message
    news:1180390796.945800.239040@i13g2000prf.googlegr oups.com...
    > The new HP35S (the HP 35 35th anniversary model) has arrived:
    > http://www.calculators-hp.com/35s.html
    >
    > and it looks supurb!
    >
    > Dave.
    >




  2. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...


    "Kevin" wrote in message
    news:h8-dnec1EuYF__3bnZ2dnUVZ_t6qnZ2d@comcast.com...
    > Where is the P->R and R->P?


    ARG, theta and i?

    MS


  3. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    On May 28, 2:19 pm, "altz...@gmail.com" wrote:
    > The new HP35S (the HP 35 35th anniversary model) has arrived:http://www.calculators-hp.com/35s.html
    >
    > and it looks supurb!
    >
    > Dave.


    am i living in an alternative universe...???
    this link doesn't work, hp has no references to it, and i can't find
    anything on it on the web...???


  4. Re: The HP 35S has arrived... [but where are P->R and R->P?]

    On Fri, 01 Jun 2007 13:17:09 -0500, Kevin wrote:

    > Where is the P->R and R->P?


    Such commands,
    transforming two independent stack level inputs
    into two independent stack level outputs,
    essentially became obsolete,
    when single stack objects became capable of containing
    both coordinates within one single object,
    and when *automatic* display in alternate coordinate modes
    (as well as parsing of input in alternate coordinate modes)
    was built into products, such as the HP28/48/49/50 series
    [I have no idea how the 35S works, however]

    It is, in some sense, like asking "where's the clutch pedal"
    in an automobile upgraded to automatic transmission;
    if there *are* such commands in the 35S, then it would be
    only an indication that more advanced features are missing.

    The HP48/49/50 series has V\->, \->V2 and \->V3 commands
    as more generalized alternatives when needed;
    these commands transform between single stack objects
    representing two- or three-dimensional vectors
    (or complex numbers) and multiple stack objects
    representing the separated individual coordinates,
    with the transformation being made to (or from)
    coordinates in your choice of rectangular,
    cylindrical, or spherical polar coordinates.

    The older R\->P and P\->R transformations
    are a subset of those in the preceding paragraph.

    As Massimo Santin notes, ABS and ARG (applied to
    complex number objects having rectangular coordinates)
    provide the polar coordinates for the same object;
    it's highly likely that the inverse operations
    were not omitted, either.

    R\->P and P\->R were provided in the HP15C,
    where in "real" stack mode they operated in the older way,
    with two stack levels each for input and output,
    but in "complex" mode, these operated on one stack level only,
    upon the pair of coordinates already contained in that one level.

    Eventually evolution dropped off the need to bother,
    because later calcs could have rectangular coordinates
    in the object on the stack, yet *display* the object
    as polar coordinates, and similarly you could type in
    a set of polar coordinates, and the object built internally
    would already have those changed into rectangular, so
    of what more use were explicit conversion commands to the user?

    If R\->P and P\->R are not found in the product,
    rest assured that there is instead something better,
    or something which will in a few keystrokes
    accomplish anyway what the former commands used to do.

    On the HP48/49/50, for example,
    you can assign the following programs to any keys
    (note that they just employ the more general commands
    that were mentioned earlier):

    P->R: \<< -16. SF \->V2 -16. CF V\-> \>>
    R->P: \<< -16. CF \->V2 -16. SF V\-> \>>

    [r->] [OFF]

  5. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    Formerly:

    > The new HP35S (the HP 35 35th anniversary model) has arrived:
    > http://www.calculators-hp.com/35s.html


    On Fri, 01 Jun 2007 17:09:24 -0500:

    > am i living in an alternative universe...???
    > this link doesn't work, hp has no references to it,
    > and i can't find anything on it on the web...???


    The Big, Bad Wolf may have scared it away;
    perhaps it will be emboldened again
    on its scheduled release date?

    -[ ]-

  6. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    More about http://www.calculators-hp.com
    (where the HP35S has momentarily disappeared)

    As of this moment, a quote from that main page:

    HP, the company which invented
    the first scientific pocket calculator in 1972,
    presents a complete range of 12 calculators
    designed for the students in mathematics and sciences,
    the engineers, the scientists, the real-estate agents,
    the financial and commercial consultants.

    Listing the calculators shown in each "Range":

    Graphing: HP39gs, HP40gs, HP48gII, HP50g
    Scientific: HP9s, HP30s, HP33s
    Financial: HP10bII, HP12c, HP12c Platinum, HP17bII+

    I count a total of 11, in all these lists.

    Did you see #12 whisked away in the dark?

    http://www.britmovie.co.uk/directors...raphy/022.html
    http://www.amazon.com/dp/6303346332

    -[ ]-

  7. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...


    "TranslucentAmoebae" wrote in message
    news:1180735764.614887.85880@q75g2000hsh.googlegro ups.com...
    > On May 28, 2:19 pm, "altz...@gmail.com" wrote:
    >> The new HP35S (the HP 35 35th anniversary model) has
    >> arrived:http://www.calculators-hp.com/35s.html
    >>
    >> and it looks supurb!
    >>
    >> Dave.

    >
    > am i living in an alternative universe...???
    > this link doesn't work, hp has no references to it, and i can't find
    > anything on it on the web...???
    >


    I've posted the pdf on alt.binaries.schematics.electronic.

    Bob



  8. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    ppeb wrote:
    : On May 29, 6:09 am, Giancarlo
    : wrote:
    : > On 29 Mag, 13:03, ppeb wrote:
    : >
    : > > It looks good. I will get one. It only lacks one big thing: I/O. How
    : > > soon will we see a USB or serial port hacked in?
    : >
    : > Hi.
    : > I think that providing some I/O would prevent the calc from being
    : > accepted in many tests and exams, so maybe HP wouldn't run the risk of
    : > loosing a slice of the market...
    : > Just a thought.
    : > Best regards.
    : > Giancarlo

    : Who cares about it being accepted in exams? I'm talking about a major
    : extension to its usefulness by having offline storage capability, not
    : to mention sharing programs with other users.

    In my never humble opinion we should all care about the machines being
    accepted for use in exams. The reality is that most people choose a
    calculator while in school and stick with it. Why would a student go
    with HP calculators knowing that they're not usable in exams?

    The more students that start with HP calculators the more users in the
    future and the better the future of HP calculators in the future.

    --




    -------------------
    Keep working millions on welfare depend on you

  9. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    ppeb wrote:
    : On May 30, 10:30 am, "Joel Kolstad"
    : wrote:
    : > "ppeb" wrote in message
    : >
    : > news:1180492146.903470.82640@p47g2000hsd.googlegro ups.com...
    : >
    : > > Who cares about it being accepted in exams?
    : >
    : > Anyone who wants HP to keep making calculators. The "high end" line of HP
    : > calculators (such as the 50g) probably don't begin to generate enough revenue
    : > for HP to keep a calculator division around -- they need the revenues from the
    : > lower-end calculators, and being able to sell those is largely contingent upon
    : > them not being so powerful that they're banned from exams and the large
    : > student market quits buying them.

    : To reiterate, I believe the need exists for a 35s with I/O.

    It would be nice it HP released a similar model with a slot for a memory
    card. A cable would be worthless to me since I only run linux and HP
    doesn't support linux.

    : > > I'm talking about a major
    : > > extension to its usefulness by having offline storage capability, not
    : > > to mention sharing programs with other users.
    : >
    : > Why not just get a 50g?

    : Although the 50g is something many can consider purchasing, it isn't
    : the tool of choice, a classic RPN keystroke programmable machine is.
    : If you attended CHIP meetings here in Chicago you would understand.
    : There is a strong demand for a follow on to the 41/42S/15C.

    You can also see what the demand is like on ebay!! The last auction for
    a 42S I followed went for over $400!!! In my again never humble opinion
    it HP released an updated version of the 42S like they did with the 32SII
    there would take six monthes to produce enough machines to cover the
    backlog in orders.


    --




    -------------------
    Keep working millions on welfare depend on you

  10. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    In article ,
    Frank Pittel wrote:

    > In my never humble opinion we should all care about the machines being
    > accepted for use in exams. The reality is that most people choose a
    > calculator while in school and stick with it. Why would a student go
    > with HP calculators knowing that they're not usable in exams?


    Perhaps he realizes that he has a life also beyond the exam, where the calc
    can be useful?

    I got several HP calculators myself while in college, but I never used
    them at exams - they weren't allowed since they were programmable. I
    liked them anyway.

    > The more students that start with HP calculators the more users in the
    > future and the better the future of HP calculators in the future.


    I sure hope that HP won't enforce some "features ceiling" on their calc
    from what is accepted at exams. After all, the most serious calculation
    needs occur outside exams....

    --
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Paul Schlyter, Grev Turegatan 40, SE-114 38 Stockholm, SWEDEN
    e-mail: pausch at stockholm dot bostream dot se
    WWW: http://stjarnhimlen.se/

  11. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    Frank Pittel wrote:

    > In my again never humble opinion, if HP released an updated version
    > of the 42S like they did with the 32SII, it would take six months to
    > produce enough machines to cover the backlog in orders.


    Oh, the PAINFUL memories...

    The HP-42S gave me more *sadness* than any other HP calculator, for
    three reasons:

    (1) Its LCD had HORRIBLE contrast. Damn thing was almost impossible to
    read except in very bright light.

    (2) Its method for keying in alpha characters was insane. Great for
    finger muscle workouts but not much else. Its implementation was
    either a practical joke by a soon-to-be-ex-HP-Corvallis-employee, or
    legacy code from machines used before the invention of the opposable
    thumb.

    (3) I took it to dinner at a fancy restaurant once, and it left with
    SOMEBODY ELSE without warning or explanation or apology! True story! I
    am NOT making this up! I've never forgiven it for that heartless
    treachery, even though I'm sure that it would say that it was actually
    the THIEF'S fault, but hey, they ALWAYS say that, don' t they? >:-(

    If they ever reissue the 42S, don't show me one! Some wounds never
    heal.

    -Joe- -and it didn't even say goodbye-


  12. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    Of course the re-released 42S would have a much improved display and the
    sillyness of the way the 42S had you enter alpha characters.

    I can't help your being dumped by your 42S :-)



    Joe Horn wrote:
    : Frank Pittel wrote:

    : > In my again never humble opinion, if HP released an updated version
    : > of the 42S like they did with the 32SII, it would take six months to
    : > produce enough machines to cover the backlog in orders.

    : Oh, the PAINFUL memories...

    : The HP-42S gave me more *sadness* than any other HP calculator, for
    : three reasons:

    : (1) Its LCD had HORRIBLE contrast. Damn thing was almost impossible to
    : read except in very bright light.

    : (2) Its method for keying in alpha characters was insane. Great for
    : finger muscle workouts but not much else. Its implementation was
    : either a practical joke by a soon-to-be-ex-HP-Corvallis-employee, or
    : legacy code from machines used before the invention of the opposable
    : thumb.

    : (3) I took it to dinner at a fancy restaurant once, and it left with
    : SOMEBODY ELSE without warning or explanation or apology! True story! I
    : am NOT making this up! I've never forgiven it for that heartless
    : treachery, even though I'm sure that it would say that it was actually
    : the THIEF'S fault, but hey, they ALWAYS say that, don' t they? >:-(

    : If they ever reissue the 42S, don't show me one! Some wounds never
    : heal.

    : -Joe- -and it didn't even say goodbye-


    --




    -------------------
    Keep working millions on welfare depend on you

  13. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    Joe Horn wrote:

    > Frank Pittel wrote:
    >
    >
    >>In my again never humble opinion, if HP released an updated version
    >>of the 42S like they did with the 32SII, it would take six months to
    >>produce enough machines to cover the backlog in orders.

    >
    >
    > Oh, the PAINFUL memories...
    >
    > The HP-42S gave me more *sadness* than any other HP calculator, for
    > three reasons:
    >
    > (1) Its LCD had HORRIBLE contrast. Damn thing was almost impossible to
    > read except in very bright light.
    >
    > (2) Its method for keying in alpha characters was insane. Great for
    > finger muscle workouts but not much else. Its implementation was
    > either a practical joke by a soon-to-be-ex-HP-Corvallis-employee, or
    > legacy code from machines used before the invention of the opposable
    > thumb.
    >
    > (3) I took it to dinner at a fancy restaurant once, and it left with
    > SOMEBODY ELSE without warning or explanation or apology! True story! I
    > am NOT making this up! I've never forgiven it for that heartless
    > treachery, even though I'm sure that it would say that it was actually
    > the THIEF'S fault, but hey, they ALWAYS say that, don' t they? >:-(
    >
    > If they ever reissue the 42S, don't show me one! Some wounds never
    > heal.
    >


    So, you mean writing SMS on brand new mobile phone is a better way - no
    way IMHO.

    to make few labels and program name in hp42S is HP42:s input method
    resonable and not need learning time to begin written, compare to many
    mobil-phones text-input methode - this mobile hidden 'helping' rules
    (but emty library) can pushing me to nuts...

    hp42S is not a PDA to make big literature or writting advanced program,
    is a every day using mathematic tool for practical working engineer in
    electrical and electronic field. This discret and always working complex
    numeric support is this calculators big strength and impossible to days
    to find simular calculator in small size with same full numerical
    complex support on all math-function.

    Is very few (none?) small, skirt pocket size calculators to days can
    easly handle square root on complex numbers (for example handle
    telegraph formula), reflectioncoffecients in complex impedances or
    handle matrices with complex numbers... etc. etc.





  14. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    "Paul Schlyter" wrote in message
    news:f3slcl$1of8$1@merope.saaf.se...
    > I sure hope that HP won't enforce some "features ceiling" on their calc
    > from what is accepted at exams.


    They already have one, and I'm sure that every time HP marketing sees an
    opportunity for making a new calculator, a lot of thought goes into, "How
    powerful can we make this without it being banned on exams?"

    > After all, the most serious calculation
    > needs occur outside exams....


    They do, although the high-end calculator market is rather small today, I
    think, realtive to, say, a couple decades back due to the ubiquity of PCs. I
    keep my HP 50g at work, and while I do use it for many activities, as soon as
    I need something involving graphing, symbolic calculation, etc., it's
    worthwhile to fire up MathCAD or Matlab.

    I took an exam recently that required non-programmable calculators and I ended
    up with a Casio FX-115ES, which I think is just about the most powerful
    calculator available that isn't programmable. Nice machine, especially for
    the $18 asking price. I'd love to see HP do something like this -- a cheap,
    full dot matrix LCD, dual-power non-programmable *RPN* machine.

    ---Joel



  15. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 04:44:41 -0500, Joe Horn wrote:

    > The HP42S LCD had HORRIBLE contrast.


    You got a lemon? (Or EduCALC got a whole bad lot?)

    I think the "recessed" display series was clearer than the
    original "flat" display, but I have no problem with either;
    didn't the 27S/42S/17B all have the same display?

    http://www.hpmuseum.org/27s.jpg [recessed]
    http://www.hpmuseum.org/42s.jpg [recessed]
    http://www.hpmuseum.org/17b.jpg [flat, polarizer on top]

    > The HP42S method for keying in alpha characters was insane.


    For anyone who hasn't seen:

    Same method as on financial models, e.g. HP17B[ii]
    (which even has no Alpha shift key)

    First keypress - the six menu keys show:

    [ABCDE] [FGHI] [JKLM] [NOPQ] [RSTUV] [WXYZ]

    Second keypress (assuming ABCDE):

    [A] [B] [C] [D] [E] [OTHER]

    "Other" (present on financial calcs only)
    leads to a menu of all special characters;
    a sixth menu label [MORE] takes the place of
    the dedicated [NXT] key that the 48/49/50 series needs,
    as is also common to HP17B[ii], HP18C, etc.

    Note that although the 32S[ii], by contrast, has individual letters
    on the keyboard, somewhat necessary for STO/RCL using
    registers named via letters instead of via numbers
    (42S was still using numbers), it still has no Alpha shift key,
    and the entry of *every* letter must therefore always be preceded
    by pressing STO or RCL, even if you are spelling out something
    (like my name, for display when my calc turns on);
    is that equally "insane"?

    http://www.hpmuseum.org/32s.jpg [also earlier "flat" display]

    I think it was remarkably clever of whoever thought it up
    to manage to provide Alpha entry on each calc,
    without ever needing an alpha keyboard or alpha shift key;
    careful study of the 26-letter menu will show that the fit
    is so close, there was no other way to get all 26 letters into it;
    once you have used this a bit, it's in fact extremely natural,
    especially since you can predict exactly which menu key will be
    the second keypress, just by looking at the key you press first.

    So what Joe undoubtedly means is that all these designs were insanely
    clever and brilliant -- more than I would ever have thought up myself,
    and perfectly suited to what each model was, in its time.

    [ ] [OFF] (there's only *one* shift key on these calcs!

  16. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    John H Meyers wrote:
    > On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 04:44:41 -0500, Joe Horn wrote:
    >
    >> The HP42S LCD had HORRIBLE contrast.

    >
    > You got a lemon? (Or EduCALC got a whole bad lot?)


    Mine has a horrible display as well.

    I came across this late and it looks like all the web
    pages about the new HP 35S have been removed, even from
    the HP museum.

    Is this a late April fools joke or what?

    Cheers,

    Rich

    > I think the "recessed" display series was clearer than the
    > original "flat" display, but I have no problem with either;
    > didn't the 27S/42S/17B all have the same display?
    >
    > http://www.hpmuseum.org/27s.jpg [recessed]
    > http://www.hpmuseum.org/42s.jpg [recessed]
    > http://www.hpmuseum.org/17b.jpg [flat, polarizer on top]
    >
    >> The HP42S method for keying in alpha characters was insane.

    >
    > For anyone who hasn't seen:
    >
    > Same method as on financial models, e.g. HP17B[ii]
    > (which even has no Alpha shift key)
    >
    > First keypress - the six menu keys show:
    >
    > [ABCDE] [FGHI] [JKLM] [NOPQ] [RSTUV] [WXYZ]
    >
    > Second keypress (assuming ABCDE):
    >
    > [A] [B] [C] [D] [E] [OTHER]
    >
    > "Other" (present on financial calcs only)
    > leads to a menu of all special characters;
    > a sixth menu label [MORE] takes the place of
    > the dedicated [NXT] key that the 48/49/50 series needs,
    > as is also common to HP17B[ii], HP18C, etc.
    >
    > Note that although the 32S[ii], by contrast, has individual letters
    > on the keyboard, somewhat necessary for STO/RCL using
    > registers named via letters instead of via numbers
    > (42S was still using numbers), it still has no Alpha shift key,
    > and the entry of *every* letter must therefore always be preceded
    > by pressing STO or RCL, even if you are spelling out something
    > (like my name, for display when my calc turns on);
    > is that equally "insane"?
    >
    > http://www.hpmuseum.org/32s.jpg [also earlier "flat" display]
    >
    > I think it was remarkably clever of whoever thought it up
    > to manage to provide Alpha entry on each calc,
    > without ever needing an alpha keyboard or alpha shift key;
    > careful study of the 26-letter menu will show that the fit
    > is so close, there was no other way to get all 26 letters into it;
    > once you have used this a bit, it's in fact extremely natural,
    > especially since you can predict exactly which menu key will be
    > the second keypress, just by looking at the key you press first.
    >
    > So what Joe undoubtedly means is that all these designs were insanely
    > clever and brilliant -- more than I would ever have thought up myself,
    > and perfectly suited to what each model was, in its time.
    >
    > [ ] [OFF] (there's only *one* shift key on these calcs!


  17. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    On Jun 2, 1:12 pm, pau...@saaf.se (Paul Schlyter) wrote:
    > In article ,
    > Frank Pittel wrote:
    >
    > > In my never humble opinion we should all care about the machines being
    > > accepted for use in exams. The reality is that most people choose a
    > > calculator while in school and stick with it. Why would a student go
    > > with HP calculators knowing that they're not usable in exams?

    >
    > Perhaps he realizes that he has a life also beyond the exam, where the calc
    > can be useful?
    >
    > I got several HP calculators myself while in college, but I never used
    > them at exams - they weren't allowed since they were programmable. I
    > liked them anyway.
    >
    > > The more students that start with HP calculators the more users in the
    > > future and the better the future of HP calculators in the future.

    >
    > I sure hope that HP won't enforce some "features ceiling" on their calc
    > from what is accepted at exams. After all, the most serious calculation
    > needs occur outside exams....
    >
    > --
    > ----------------------------------------------------------------
    > Paul Schlyter, Grev Turegatan 40, SE-114 38 Stockholm, SWEDEN
    > e-mail: pausch at stockholm dot bostream dot se
    > WWW: http://stjarnhimlen.se/


    Mathematical Salutations,
    I definately have need for calculators that go beyond exams.
    I want a shirt pocket calculator that can run an alignment program and
    store thousands of coordinates including elevation and a description
    in .asc format. And be able to I/O the coordinate file.
    For me it doesn't need to connect to survey equipment, For that I
    would prefer to use a full size Data Collector.
    But I would definately pay for the ability to sync my Data Collector
    to a shirt pocket calculator that I would always have in my shirt
    pocket, so when I walk in an office to get some information and I get
    asked for job information I could query said small data collector for
    the same type of answers available in my large weatherproof Data
    Collector that is outside in my truck or attatched to an ATV.
    That is what I want in a "Dream Calculator". Why not? I might not ever
    get that, but the need for calculators that go far beyond the exam
    limitations does exist.
    Chad Wagner
    Construction Surveyor in Alaska


  18. Re: The HP 35S has arrived...

    "Frank Pittel" wrote in message
    news:8LOdnV78qutHB_zbnZ2dnUVZ_ualnZ2d@giganews.com ...
    X
    > You can also see what the demand is like on ebay!! The last auction for
    > a 42S I followed went for over $400!!! In my again never humble opinion
    > it HP released an updated version of the 42S like they did with the 32SII
    > there would take six monthes to produce enough machines to cover the
    > backlog in orders.


    I'll sell my 42S at 400 euros (+shipping) right away!!!



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