New Samson HP50 serial cable - Hewlett Packard

This is a discussion on New Samson HP50 serial cable - Hewlett Packard ; dot wrote: > On Sat, 21 Apr 2007 16:11:33 -0400, "James M. Prange" > wrote: > >> Just make yourself a cable with a "USB 4-pin mini-B" connector on >> each end, with the ground pins connected straight through, each ...

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Thread: New Samson HP50 serial cable

  1. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    dot wrote:
    > On Sat, 21 Apr 2007 16:11:33 -0400, "James M. Prange"
    > wrote:
    >
    >> Just make yourself a cable with a "USB 4-pin mini-B" connector on
    >> each end, with the ground pins connected straight through, each
    >> calculator's transmit pin connected to the other's receive pin,
    >> and the battery+ pin left unconnected.

    >
    > You say that as though it were easy. Good luck trying to just "find"
    > a USB flat 4-pin connector that is compatible with the hp50g form
    > factor. Then *if* you do find one, you aren't likely to be able to
    > make yourself a cable by putting those connectors on each end.


    Yes, attaching those little itty-bitty connectors to a cable would
    be very tricky. So get a pair of cables with the required
    connector already attached to one end, cut the unwanted connectors
    off of the other ends, and splice the wires together as needed.

    Better yet, get a cable with the desired connectors on both ends,
    check how the pins are connected, and if needed (as seems very
    likely), cut the cable and splice the wires as needed.

    > In the Portland, Or. metropolitan area, I have checked several sources
    > and the closest suitable connector to be found was a USB type A to
    > flat 4 adaptor in a kit of various adaptors selling for $30 at Fry's.
    > If you ask for a "USB 4 pin mini-B" connectorized cable, you will soon
    > discover that the form factor won't be compatible with the hp50g.
    >
    > I checked electronics stores, camera stores, and the so-called big box
    > consumer electronics outlets (Best Buy, Circuit City, et al).


    Try a search on eBay; a cable with the required connector on at
    least one end isn't all that difficult to find, and usually a lot
    cheaper as well.

    That said, a "4-pin mini-B" connector isn't defined by the USB
    Implementers Forum. Any such connectors are "captive", that is,
    implemented for specific devices, and there seem to be more than
    one design of them available, so be sure that you see a good
    picture of the connector before buying a cable.

    > I *wish* it were as simple as you make it sound. I have a bag full of
    > ST3232 chips, all the misc components and Tiwags schematic all set to
    > go! Now if I could just lay my hands on those compatible connectors!


    Will you be offering the cable/converter for sale when you get it
    working?

    > In the meantime, I bought the Samson Cables version, which doesn't
    > seem to work at 2400 Baud, yet it does work at 4800 Baud (using Conn4x
    > with the PC). I really need 1200 Baud but it's not supported and ....
    > oh well.


    Maybe try it with HPComm or HyperTerminal at 2400bps?

    --
    Regards,
    James


  2. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    On Sat, 21 Apr 2007 20:04:09 -0400, "James M. Prange"
    wrote:

    >
    >Will you be offering the cable/converter for sale when you get it
    >working?


    No. This is just for a hobby level project, but I ordered them from
    Newark Electronics, and the minimum billing meant I got more than I
    really needed. Who knows what I'll do with the rest of them,
    especially if the cable with the so called mini-B proves too elusive.
    >
    >> In the meantime, I bought the Samson Cables version, which doesn't
    >> seem to work at 2400 Baud, yet it does work at 4800 Baud (using Conn4x
    >> with the PC). I really need 1200 Baud but it's not supported and ....
    >> oh well.

    >
    >Maybe try it with HPComm or HyperTerminal at 2400bps?


    Good idea with the HyperTerminal. I'll try that and see what happens.

    -Dot-


  3. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    > > In the meantime, I bought the Samson Cables version, which doesn't
    > > seem to work at 2400 Baud, yet it does work at 4800 Baud (using Conn4x
    > > with the PC). I really need 1200 Baud but it's not supported and ....
    > > oh well.

    >
    > Maybe try it with HPComm or HyperTerminal at 2400bps?


    Hello, I have been successful in getting my Samson cable to work with
    HyperTerminal at 2400 baud. HOWEVER, I don't use the built-in XModem
    from the I/O menu--it doesn't seem to work. Everything works fine if
    I use the XSend command from the IOMan library (available from www.hpcalc.org).

    Jim D. explained the power up/down configuration and I can see how I
    can connect to my Fluke gear. I bought a standard 9-pin DSub9MM and a
    project box with a 9V battery holder. I'm going to cut the cable in
    half and power the RTS side of the Fluke cable with +9V (through a
    current-limit resistor and power switch). DTR will be shorted to
    ground (the interfacing guide available online said this was okay if a
    negative voltage is not available). I will see if it provides the
    correct mark voltage (<-3V) in this configuration (i.e., without
    having a negative voltage on DTR). I'll use a similar approach when I
    want half-duplex bit-banging (that is, I'll just provide a bias
    voltage to the unused Tx pin). The cable is really quite nice


  4. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    On 21 Apr 2007 17:39:05 -0700, electronguy
    wrote:

    >> > In the meantime, I bought the Samson Cables version, which doesn't
    >> > seem to work at 2400 Baud, yet it does work at 4800 Baud (using Conn4x
    >> > with the PC). I really need 1200 Baud but it's not supported and ....
    >> > oh well.

    >>
    >> Maybe try it with HPComm or HyperTerminal at 2400bps?

    >
    >Hello, I have been successful in getting my Samson cable to work with
    >HyperTerminal at 2400 baud. HOWEVER, I don't use the built-in XModem
    >from the I/O menu--it doesn't seem to work. Everything works fine if
    >I use the XSend command from the IOMan library (available from www.hpcalc.org).
    >
    >Jim D. explained the power up/down configuration and I can see how I
    >can connect to my Fluke gear. I bought a standard 9-pin DSub9MM and a
    >project box with a 9V battery holder. I'm going to cut the cable in
    >half and power the RTS side of the Fluke cable with +9V (through a
    >current-limit resistor and power switch). DTR will be shorted to
    >ground (the interfacing guide available online said this was okay if a
    >negative voltage is not available). I will see if it provides the
    >correct mark voltage (<-3V) in this configuration (i.e., without
    >having a negative voltage on DTR). I'll use a similar approach when I
    >want half-duplex bit-banging (that is, I'll just provide a bias
    >voltage to the unused Tx pin). The cable is really quite nice


    Thanks for the above info. I just d/l'd IOMAN and I'll see what I can
    learn. I was using XMODEM-SERVER via the CONNECT feature of Conn4x.
    It worked fine at 4800 but not at all on 2400. I think I read that
    someone else was able to connect at 2400. It may be a parameter
    setting or something that prevents the 2400 baud from working. I'll
    try to get smarter about that tomorrow.

    -Dot-


  5. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    On Apr 21, 3:46 pm, dot wrote:
    > In the Portland, Or. metropolitan area, I have checked several sources..


    Hi Dot,

    I'm also in the Portland area too (Beaverton). Have you tried PCH
    cables (http://store.pchcables.com/) in Hillsboro? Pat is a really
    knowledgeable and said he had a kit with interchangeable ends - one
    being the 50G connector but with two notches instead of one (I had
    previously sent him a photo of the 50G connector ports and this was
    his response). I didn't buy one because I stumbled across a USB cable
    with the correct "mini-B" end (at a thrift store) and ended up making
    my own 50G cable (photos of the cable posted in another thread).

    mk



  6. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    > Thanks for the above info. I just d/l'd IOMAN and I'll see what I can
    > learn. I was using XMODEM-SERVER via the CONNECT feature of Conn4x.
    > It worked fine at 4800 but not at all on 2400. I think I read that
    > someone else was able to connect at 2400. It may be a parameter
    > setting or something that prevents the 2400 baud from working. I'll
    > try to get smarter about that tomorrow.
    >
    > -Dot-- Hide quoted text -


    I had troubles with Conn4x at 9600 baud and lower. I was very
    concerned when I first got the cable that something was wrong--even
    with HyperTerminal I was losing faith with XModem until I tried the
    IOMan version (I was getting text to appear properly on the screen, so
    I knew the cable HAD to be working in some capacity). But, for
    Conn4x, I get the exact results Jim D. does--nothing at 9600 baud of
    lower using XModem Server.



  7. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    On 21 Apr 2007 18:32:10 -0700, mk wrote:

    >On Apr 21, 3:46 pm, dot wrote:
    >> In the Portland, Or. metropolitan area, I have checked several sources..

    >
    >Hi Dot,
    >
    >I'm also in the Portland area too (Beaverton). Have you tried PCH
    >cables (http://store.pchcables.com/) in Hillsboro? Pat is a really
    >knowledgeable and said he had a kit with interchangeable ends - one
    >being the 50G connector but with two notches instead of one (I had
    >previously sent him a photo of the 50G connector ports and this was
    >his response). I didn't buy one because I stumbled across a USB cable
    >with the correct "mini-B" end (at a thrift store) and ended up making
    >my own 50G cable (photos of the cable posted in another thread).
    >
    >mk
    >


    No, I haven't tried PCH Cables. Thanks for the lead. If it's a kit,
    though, it may be the same type of thing they sell at Fry's. It was
    in a blister pack containing a cable and several adapters. One of
    them looked like it would fit, which was called a flat 4 USB adapter.

    At that point I didn't want to spend $30 just for an adapter, when I
    really needed a cable with that connector on at least one end. Norvac
    had some surplus cables with a USB type A connector on one end, and
    pig tail leads on the other. I was thinking about using that for
    connecting to a minibox which would house the RS-232 circuit hardware.
    From the USB type A I could then adapt to just about anything on an as
    needed basis. Some of the equipment I want to use this with has
    RJ-45, DB-9M, and DB-25M connectors.

    -Dot-




  8. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    On 21 Apr 2007 19:41:57 -0700, electronguy
    wrote:

    >> Thanks for the above info. I just d/l'd IOMAN and I'll see what I can
    >> learn. I was using XMODEM-SERVER via the CONNECT feature of Conn4x.
    >> It worked fine at 4800 but not at all on 2400. I think I read that
    >> someone else was able to connect at 2400. It may be a parameter
    >> setting or something that prevents the 2400 baud from working. I'll
    >> try to get smarter about that tomorrow.
    >>
    >> -Dot-- Hide quoted text -

    >
    >I had troubles with Conn4x at 9600 baud and lower. I was very
    >concerned when I first got the cable that something was wrong--even
    >with HyperTerminal I was losing faith with XModem until I tried the
    >IOMan version (I was getting text to appear properly on the screen, so
    >I knew the cable HAD to be working in some capacity). But, for
    >Conn4x, I get the exact results Jim D. does--nothing at 9600 baud of
    >lower using XModem Server.


    Did you specifically try 4800 Baud? I haven't checked it rigorously,
    but it seems to work on my system with Conn4x and XModem Server. The
    USB side works just fine. Makes me wonder what the problem is with
    some of the other baud rates. Maybe serial communications was
    actually designed to be used as a torture technique to drive people
    crazy? (It's working!)

    -Dot-


  9. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    Jean-Yves Avenard wrote:
    > John H Meyers wrote:
    >
    >> Has anyone considered (or already produced) such an item?

    >
    >
    > I'm pretty sure that they come with all HP40gs as they don't have an IR
    > port and need a way to communicate with each other.
    >
    > JY


    They do. Standard in the box.

  10. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    >
    > Did you specifically try 4800 Baud? I haven't checked it rigorously,
    > but it seems to work on my system with Conn4x and XModem Server. The
    > USB side works just fine. Makes me wonder what the problem is with
    > some of the other baud rates. Maybe serial communications was
    > actually designed to be used as a torture technique to drive people
    > crazy? (It's working!)
    >


    Aha! Yes, it seems to work at 4800 baud. I must not have tried that
    one and went straight to 2400.


  11. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    On Sat, 21 Apr 2007 18:41:16 -0500, Jim D. wrote:

    > My tests have indicated at 9600 baud and below conn4x incorrectly
    > times out on XMODEM transfers. It is probably machine dependent,
    > so you may see 4800.


    > I spent a considerable amount of time with a serial analyzer
    > checking byte by byte that the calculator was attempting
    > to send the correct data, and it does. Further, the serial analyzer
    > notes any incorrectly sent characters, and it no time did it see any.


    > So I will say that the 50G and the cable DO work correctly
    > at 2400 baud.


    That's quite a bit of fine analysis!

    Did you ever hear of a "Jim D" who was once at HP,
    and used to offer a lot of extra HP calc info
    (including some great books)?

    -[ ]-

  12. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    On Sat, 21 Apr 2007 09:13:42 -0500:

    > got an error when trying
    > http://www.educalc.net/1045489.page
    > (Easter Eggs for 40GS)


    May be working again now.

    AMIGOS > "COLIN"

  13. Re: New Samson HP50 serial cable

    John H Meyers wrote:
    > On Sat, 21 Apr 2007 09:13:42 -0500:
    >
    >
    >>got an error when trying
    >>http://www.educalc.net/1045489.page
    >>(Easter Eggs for 40GS)

    >
    >
    > May be working again now.
    >
    > AMIGOS > "COLIN"


    Yup. That's me. ::blushes modestly::
    I was lucky enough to be involved in a small way in the Enterprise
    project back in 2000 that produced the 39/40G.
    Lots of fun. :-) JYA built in a number of easter eggs, including two games!

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