Re: Put GEOS software in voting machines.. - GEOS

This is a discussion on Re: Put GEOS software in voting machines.. - GEOS ; (forgot to finish my thought before pressing send!) ..... be more liberal with security adn financial terms compared to the other elections systems comapnies descibed in that vegas slot mahcine/elections machine newspapaer article posted previously. I wonder if the nolkia ...

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Thread: Re: Put GEOS software in voting machines..

  1. Re: Put GEOS software in voting machines..

    (forgot to finish my thought before pressing send!)

    ..... be more liberal with security adn financial terms compared to the
    other elections systems comapnies descibed in that vegas slot
    mahcine/elections machine newspapaer article posted previously.

    I wonder if the nolkia 9000 could be modified for remote transmission of
    polling site elections results, and possible be connected to a printer
    for the generation of paper trail.

    finally, if geos were adopted as teh softare for a widely used electonic
    voting system, lots more folks might try using and even programming for
    the geos environment..





    hyubso wrote:
    Plus, breadbox
    > can be more liberal
    >
    >



  2. Re: Put GEOS software in voting machines..

    hyubso schrieb:
    >
    > (forgot to finish my thought before pressing send!)
    >
    > .... be more liberal with security adn financial terms compared to the
    > other elections systems comapnies descibed in that vegas slot
    > mahcine/elections machine newspapaer article posted previously.
    >
    > I wonder if the nolkia 9000 could be modified for remote transmission of
    > polling site elections results, and possible be connected to a printer
    > for the generation of paper trail.
    >
    > finally, if geos were adopted as teh softare for a widely used electonic
    > voting system, lots more folks might try using and even programming for
    > the geos environment..


    Well, the base idea isn't bad. Unfortunately there are several problems:

    Breadbox doesn't have the money to buy itself into this business. Even
    if officially denied, it is common practice to 'support' officials with
    lots of money to get the job. The people who decide what to buy do not
    buy with their own money, so the cost is unimportant. And often the
    functionality and ecurity is unimportant also. What counts is the extra
    money they get for deciding 'right'.

    Also, while the N9000 is definitely able to do the described jobs, it is
    no longer produced. And I doubt Nokia can be convinced to restart
    production.

    I'm sure some more people would be attracted to join the GEOS
    programmers world, but most of them would be hackers, trying to write a
    virus or worm or even worse for the 'new' devices. I doubt that more
    useful applications would be the result.

    Grossibaer

  3. Re: Put GEOS software in voting machines..



    Jens-Michael Gross wrote:

    >
    > Well, the base idea isn't bad. Unfortunately there are several problems:
    >
    > Breadbox doesn't have the money to buy itself into this business. Even
    > if officially denied, it is common practice to 'support' officials with
    > lots of money to get the job.


    i guess you are describing a "bribe".. well, what if grants were
    available for pilot projects? apparently there is lots of $$ being
    thrown at "electronic voting"


    the following line is a classic, and oh so true!

    >The people who decide what to buy do not
    > buy with their own money, so the cost is unimportant.



    > And often the
    > functionality and ecurity is unimportant also. What counts is the extra
    > money they get for deciding 'right'.


    well, if something existed that was obviuosly right, sometimes it wins..

    also, with all of windows well publicized security/virus/hacker
    issues, would anyone trust it on a voting machine? GEOS's obscurity
    is an asset in this case, as is the difficulty in programming for geos,
    which reduces the risk of hacker attacks/corruption.. etc. the
    limited pool of knowledgeable geos programmers could be easily
    "monitored" or supervised or corrrupted by either honest or deviuos
    governemnt election officials...


    >
    > Also, while the N9000 is definitely able to do the described jobs, it is
    > no longer produced. And I doubt Nokia can be convinced to restart
    > production.


    well, the N9000 hardware may be obsolete and out of production, but the
    software could be updated as needed and then installed on or used in
    conjunction with newer hardware


    >
    > I'm sure some more people would be attracted to join the GEOS
    > programmers world, but most of them would be hackers, trying to write a
    > virus or worm or even worse for the 'new' devices.




    agreed

    > I doubt that more
    > useful applications would be the result.


    you never know.. but at least if geos was used on voting machines it
    would be widely used (= $$$$$$$ income for the few breadbox and geos
    developers out there)

    in other words, electronic voting might be a market for economical ,
    efficient geos based devices


    >
    > Grossibaer



  4. Re: Put GEOS software in voting machines..

    you know, breadbox is in florida and seems to have republican friendly
    political leanings.. you'd think breadbox could get a piece of this
    electronic voting market (just as Diebold has, and which its officials
    have stated would do all it could to deliver Ohio to the republicans)
    while helping to deliver florida to the Bush dynasty

    have you all seen fahrenheit 9/11? it is a GREAT film!

    more on an issue (and potential geos market) that will not go away..

    http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/27/op...27krug.html?hp


    > OP-ED COLUMNIST
    > Fear of Fraud
    > By PAUL KRUGMAN
    >
    > Published: July 27, 2004
    >
    > It's election night, and early returns suggest trouble for the incumbent. Then, mysteriously, the vote count stops and observers from the challenger's campaign see employees of a voting-machine company, one wearing a badge that identifies him as a county official, typing instructions at computers with access to the vote-tabulating software.
    > Advertisement
    >
    > When the count resumes, the incumbent pulls ahead. The challenger demands an investigation. But there are no ballots to recount, and election officials allied with the incumbent refuse to release data that could shed light on whether there was tampering with the electronic records.
    >
    > This isn't a paranoid fantasy. It's a true account of a recent election in Riverside County, Calif., reported by Andrew Gumbel of the British newspaper The Independent. Mr. Gumbel's full-length report, printed in Los Angeles City Beat, makes hair-raising reading not just because it reinforces concerns about touch-screen voting, but also because it shows how easily officials can stonewall after a suspect election.
    >
    > Some states, worried about the potential for abuse with voting machines that leave no paper trail, have banned their use this November. But Florida, which may well decide the presidential race, is not among those states, and last month state officials rejected a request to allow independent audits of the machines' integrity. A spokesman for Gov. Jeb Bush accused those seeking audits of trying to "undermine voters' confidence," and declared, "The governor has every confidence in the Department of State and the Division of Elections."
    >
    > Should the public share that confidence? Consider the felon list.
    >
    > Florida law denies the vote to convicted felons. In 2000 the state hired a firm to purge supposed felons from the list of registered voters; these voters were turned away from the polls. After the election, determined by 537 votes, it became clear that thousands of people had been wrongly disenfranchised. Since those misidentified as felons were disproportionately Democratic-leaning African-Americans, these errors may have put George W. Bush in the White House.
    >
    > This year, Florida again hired a private company - Accenture, which recently got a homeland security contract worth up to $10 billion - to prepare a felon list. Remembering 2000, journalists sought copies. State officials stonewalled, but a judge eventually ordered the list released.
    >
    > The Miami Herald quickly discovered that 2,100 citizens who had been granted clemency, restoring their voting rights, were nonetheless on the banned-voter list. Then The Sarasota Herald-Tribune discovered that only 61 of more than 47,000 supposed felons were Hispanic. So the list would have wrongly disenfranchised many legitimate African-American voters, while wrongly enfranchising many Hispanic felons. It escaped nobody's attention that in Florida, Hispanic voters tend to support Republicans.
    >
    > After first denying any systematic problem, state officials declared it an innocent mistake. They told Accenture to match a list of registered voters to a list of felons, flagging anyone whose name, date of birth and race was the same on both lists. They didn't realize, they said, that this would automatically miss felons who identified themselves as Hispanic because that category exists on voter rolls but not in state criminal records.
    >
    > But employees of a company that prepared earlier felon lists say that they repeatedly warned state election officials about that very problem.
    >
    > Let's not be coy. Jeb Bush says he won't allow an independent examination of voting machines because he has "every confidence" in his handpicked election officials. Yet those officials have a history of slipshod performance on other matters related to voting and somehow their errors always end up favoring Republicans. Why should anyone trust their verdict on the integrity of voting machines, when another convenient mistake could deliver a Republican victory in a high-stakes national election?
    >
    > This shouldn't be a partisan issue. Think about what a tainted election would do to America's sense of itself, and its role in the world. In the face of official stonewalling, doubters probably wouldn't be able to prove one way or the other whether the vote count was distorted - but if the result looked suspicious, most of the world and many Americans would believe the worst. I'll write soon about what can be done in the few weeks that remain, but here's a first step: if Governor Bush cares at all about the future of the nation, as well as his family's political fortunes, he will allow that independent audit.
    >
    >



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