WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both. - CP/M

This is a discussion on WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both. - CP/M ; Hi, I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. Does anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both? Size and speed unimportant. Other microcomputer core memory might possibly suffice if I can ...

+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 13 of 13

Thread: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

  1. WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.


    Hi,

    I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. Does
    anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    Size and speed unimportant. Other microcomputer core memory might
    possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.

    In lieu of either of those, I might try building a core I/O mapped
    register, between 1 and 8 bits in size. I've located the 1976 Byte
    article on core mem, and also found a reference to a Sep 1979 #33
    Kilobaud article (page 34) "It's time for core. Adding core memory to
    microcomputers has become possible with some new and surplus hardware
    now available to the amateur." but I've not found that magazine yet.

    Also looking for 8 ferrite cores if anyone has some extras.

    Please email me with what you have available and price.

    Thanks very much,
    ~ John
    js@cimmeri.com

  2. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    MdntTrain wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. Does
    > anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    > Size and speed unimportant. Other microcomputer core memory might
    > possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.
    >
    > In lieu of either of those, I might try building a core I/O mapped
    > register, between 1 and 8 bits in size. I've located the 1976 Byte
    > article on core mem, and also found a reference to a Sep 1979 #33
    > Kilobaud article (page 34) "It's time for core. Adding core memory to
    > microcomputers has become possible with some new and surplus hardware
    > now available to the amateur." but I've not found that magazine yet.
    >
    > Also looking for 8 ferrite cores if anyone has some extras.
    >
    > Please email me with what you have available and price.
    >

    I have a huge number of very tiny memory cores: you're welcome to a
    spoonful :-)
    But fair warning:
    1. I have no technical data on them
    2. They are so tiny, I despair of ever getting 3 or 4 wires through them.

  3. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    MdntTrain wrote:
    >
    > I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. Does
    > anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    > Size and speed unimportant. Other microcomputer core memory
    > might possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.


    Cores went out just about the time the 8080 came in. So you
    probably won't find original core memory modules for S100 boxes.
    The only use for them was to avoid loosing contents with power off,
    and they would have been generally slower than chips of the day.

    So, if you want them, learn about drivers, sense amps, inhibit
    lines, schmoo plots, etc., and design away.

    --
    [mail]: Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
    [page]:
    Try the download section.

  4. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    MdntTrain wrote:
    > Other microcomputer core memory might
    > possibly suffice


    Core memories were produced by Micro Memory for Multibus. They have shown up
    on eBay, but I've not seen any lately.

    http://www.omegaebr.com/parts.php

    Lists one, but it will probably be more than you are willing to spend.

  5. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    On Wed, 1 Oct 2008 11:24:09 -0700, David R Brooks wrote
    (in article <48e3c0c1$0$22578$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au>):

    > MdntTrain wrote:
    >> Hi,
    >>
    >> I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. Does
    >> anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    >> Size and speed unimportant. Other microcomputer core memory might
    >> possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.
    >>
    >> In lieu of either of those, I might try building a core I/O mapped
    >> register, between 1 and 8 bits in size. I've located the 1976 Byte
    >> article on core mem, and also found a reference to a Sep 1979 #33
    >> Kilobaud article (page 34) "It's time for core. Adding core memory to
    >> microcomputers has become possible with some new and surplus hardware
    >> now available to the amateur." but I've not found that magazine yet.
    >>
    >> Also looking for 8 ferrite cores if anyone has some extras.
    >>
    >> Please email me with what you have available and price.
    >>

    > I have a huge number of very tiny memory cores: you're welcome to a
    > spoonful :-)
    > But fair warning:
    > 1. I have no technical data on them
    > 2. They are so tiny, I despair of ever getting 3 or 4 wires through them.


    I have an 8K x 36 stack that is very old. I have sold several planes and one
    plane has broken wires along one side. The geometry is two blocks of 4K. You
    could make a little frame to isolate one section and connect all the X-Y
    wires. There is only one sense wire that winds though them all.

    You can have it for postage and packaging.

    I think you can still see one here.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...SOX:IT&item=18
    0292288066

    -- Charlie Springer


  6. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    Al Kossow wrote:
    > MdntTrain wrote:
    >> Other microcomputer core memory might
    >> possibly suffice

    >
    > Core memories were produced by Micro Memory for Multibus. They have shown up
    > on eBay, but I've not seen any lately.
    >
    > http://www.omegaebr.com/parts.php
    >
    > Lists one, but it will probably be more than you are willing to spend.


    Ampex too, the MCM 8086, and they were making 'em as late as 1984. I
    see one listed here, no price given:

    http://www.73.com/specs/la206.shtml

    -Frank McConnell

  7. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    On Wed, 01 Oct 2008 20:32:21 -0400, CBFalconer
    wrote:

    >MdntTrain wrote:
    >>
    >> I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. Does
    >> anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    >> Size and speed unimportant. Other microcomputer core memory
    >> might possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.

    >
    >Cores went out just about the time the 8080 came in. So you
    >probably won't find original core memory modules for S100 boxes.
    >The only use for them was to avoid loosing contents with power off,
    >and they would have been generally slower than chips of the day.
    >
    >So, if you want them, learn about drivers, sense amps, inhibit
    >lines, schmoo plots, etc., and design away.


    I have core for my PDP8 and PDP11 but I've never seen a commercial
    core plane for S100, the cost for 4K would have ben 10x that of the
    then average solidstate ram board (1977 that would have been about
    4k$++). IT's also a factor that core was disappering from most minis
    by 75 and by 1980 many had switched to ram for cost and speed reasons.
    A fast core might have had an access time of aound 600ns and a cycle
    time of not less that 1us as core is destructive read so every read
    has a following write. It was not power frugal either.

    Allison


  8. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    On Oct 1, 7:32*pm, CBFalconer wrote:
    > MdntTrain wrote:
    >
    > > I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. * *Does
    > > anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    > > Size and speed unimportant. * Other microcomputer core memory
    > > might possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.

    >
    > Cores went out just about the time the 8080 came in. *So you
    > probably won't find original core memory modules for S100 boxes.
    > The only use for them was to avoid loosing contents with power off,
    > and they would have been generally slower than chips of the day.
    >
    > So, if you want them, learn about drivers, sense amps, inhibit
    > lines, schmoo plots, etc., and design away.
    >
    > --
    > *[mail]: Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
    > *[page]:
    > * * * * * * Try the download section.


    I read "shmoo plots" (a phrase I've never seen before) and thought
    you were making a joke of some kind about the arcane nature of core
    mem, but upon looking it up, I see that shmoo plots are real and were
    actually devised for measuring the characteristics of core. Great
    memory you have, Chuck. Geeze.

    What got me interested in core is the Apollo guidance computer
    which I'd been reading about lately. It just astounds me to imagine
    flying to the moon using the kinds of computing technologies they
    had... and especially ferrite bead memories.

    JS

  9. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    On Oct 1, 8:31*pm, Frank McConnell wrote:
    > Al Kossow wrote:
    > > MdntTrain wrote:
    > >> Other microcomputer core memory might
    > >> possibly suffice

    >
    > > Core memories were produced by Micro Memory for Multibus. They have shown up
    > > on eBay, but I've not seen any lately.

    >
    > >http://www.omegaebr.com/parts.php

    >
    > > Lists one, but it will probably be more than you are willing to spend.

    >
    > Ampex too, the MCM 8086, and they were making 'em as late as 1984. *I
    > see one listed here, no price given:
    >
    > http://www.73.com/specs/la206.shtml
    >
    > -Frank McConnell


    Al, Frank... thanks for finding those boards. Unfortunately, I'm not
    familiar with Multibus... but probably could figure it out if manuals
    for those M-bus core memory boards still existed. Having a
    schematic would be my best starting place.

    JS

  10. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    On Oct 1, 10:18*pm, no.s...@no.uce.bellatlantic.net wrote:
    > On Wed, 01 Oct 2008 20:32:21 -0400, CBFalconer
    > wrote:
    >
    > >MdntTrain wrote:

    >
    > >> I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. * *Does
    > >> anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    > >> Size and speed unimportant. * Other microcomputer core memory
    > >> might possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.

    >
    > >Cores went out just about the time the 8080 came in. *So you
    > >probably won't find original core memory modules for S100 boxes.
    > >The only use for them was to avoid loosing contents with power off,
    > >and they would have been generally slower than chips of the day.

    >
    > >So, if you want them, learn about drivers, sense amps, inhibit
    > >lines, schmoo plots, etc., and design away.

    >
    > I have core for my PDP8 and PDP11 but I've never seen a commercial
    > core plane for S100, the cost for 4K would have ben 10x that of the
    > then average solidstate ram board (1977 that would have been about
    > 4k$++). * IT's also a factor that core was disappering from most minis
    > by 75 and by 1980 many had switched to ram for cost and speed reasons.
    > A fast core might have had an access time of aound 600ns and a cycle
    > time of not less that 1us as core is destructive read so every read
    > has a following write. It was not power frugal either.
    >
    > Allison


    Hi, A!

    I figured this one would rouse ya. ;-)

    Apparently, there was at least one core S-100 board made. A fellow
    named Gary Oliver wrote back in 1998 of a single board S-100 planar
    core. He'd had experience with the board in a 4 mhz Z80 Cromemco
    system, part of a building HVAC management system that needed
    nonvolatility.

    I also found your useful 1999 ClassicCMP conversation with Chuck
    McManis on PDP core and ferrite beads testing. Will save you from a
    bunch of my meddling questions.

    I did find the FMPS for a PDP-8 core memory board, and tech
    descrip and partial schematics of the PDP-11 MMV11 board (though no
    full schematic). Is either design readily convertible to S-100?

    JS

  11. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    MdntTrain wrote:
    > On Oct 1, 7:32 pm, CBFalconer wrote:
    >> MdntTrain wrote:
    >>
    >>> I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. Does
    >>> anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    >>> Size and speed unimportant. Other microcomputer core memory
    >>> might possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.

    >> Cores went out just about the time the 8080 came in. So you
    >> probably won't find original core memory modules for S100 boxes.
    >> The only use for them was to avoid loosing contents with power off,
    >> and they would have been generally slower than chips of the day.
    >>
    >> So, if you want them, learn about drivers, sense amps, inhibit
    >> lines, schmoo plots, etc., and design away.
    >>
    >> --
    >> [mail]: Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
    >> [page]:
    >> Try the download section.

    >
    > I read "shmoo plots" (a phrase I've never seen before) and thought
    > you were making a joke of some kind about the arcane nature of core
    > mem, but upon looking it up, I see that shmoo plots are real and were
    > actually devised for measuring the characteristics of core. Great
    > memory you have, Chuck. Geeze.
    >
    > What got me interested in core is the Apollo guidance computer
    > which I'd been reading about lately. It just astounds me to imagine
    > flying to the moon using the kinds of computing technologies they
    > had... and especially ferrite bead memories.
    >
    > JS

    If you only want 8 bits (ie 8 cores), maybe you can use common ferrite
    toroids. Of course, you'll need bigger drivers, but fewer of them, & the
    B-H curve won't be so hot. But for a demonstration?

  12. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    MdntTrain wrote:
    > CBFalconer wrote:
    >> MdntTrain wrote:
    >>
    >>> I'm looking to learn about and experiment with core mem. Does
    >>> anyone have an S-100 core RAM board, or a manual for one, or both?
    >>> Size and speed unimportant. Other microcomputer core memory
    >>> might possibly suffice if I can translate the interfacing scheme.

    >>
    >> Cores went out just about the time the 8080 came in. So you
    >> probably won't find original core memory modules for S100 boxes.
    >> The only use for them was to avoid loosing contents with power off,
    >> and they would have been generally slower than chips of the day.
    >>
    >> So, if you want them, learn about drivers, sense amps, inhibit
    >> lines, schmoo plots, etc., and design away.

    >
    > I read "shmoo plots" (a phrase I've never seen before) and thought
    > you were making a joke of some kind about the arcane nature of
    > core mem, but upon looking it up, I see that shmoo plots are real
    > and were actually devised for measuring the characteristics of
    > core. Great memory you have, Chuck. Geeze.


    If you remember Al Capp and real schmoos (in L'il Abner) you will
    realize that the shape of a schmoo plot was a member of that
    family. A schmoo plot allowed you to set the optimum operating
    conditions.

    --
    [mail]: Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
    [page]:
    Try the download section.

  13. Re: WTB: S-100 core memory board manual, or board, or both.

    MdntTrain wrote:
    >

    .... snip ...
    >
    > Al, Frank... thanks for finding those boards. Unfortunately,
    > I'm not familiar with Multibus... but probably could figure it
    > out if manuals for those M-bus core memory boards still existed.
    > Having a schematic would be my best starting place.


    Multibus was expensive, and came from Intel. They might be able to
    help.

    --
    [mail]: Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
    [page]:
    Try the download section.

+ Reply to Thread