Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x - CP/M

This is a discussion on Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x - CP/M ; I recently purchased a Kaypro 2x, and need a boot disk. I have tried using downloaded files, but this does not write the needed system files to the disk. The ROM is 81-292A. Does any one have a disk available?...

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Thread: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

  1. Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    I recently purchased a Kaypro 2x, and need a boot disk. I have tried
    using downloaded files, but this does not write the needed system files
    to the disk. The ROM is 81-292A. Does any one have a disk available?


  2. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    On 27 Jul 2006 10:03:28 -0700, "rmryan@wowway.com"
    wrote:

    >I recently purchased a Kaypro 2x, and need a boot disk. I have tried
    >using downloaded files, but this does not write the needed system files
    >to the disk. The ROM is 81-292A. Does any one have a disk available?


    More likely they were written on the wrong format drive. Kaypros used
    48TPI drives, is the system you made copies on running same?

    Allison


  3. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    nospam@nouce.bellatlantic.net wrote:
    > On 27 Jul 2006 10:03:28 -0700, "rmryan@wowway.com"
    > wrote:
    >
    > >I recently purchased a Kaypro 2x, and need a boot disk. I have tried
    > >using downloaded files, but this does not write the needed system files
    > >to the disk. The ROM is 81-292A. Does any one have a disk available?

    >
    > More likely they were written on the wrong format drive. Kaypros used
    > 48TPI drives, is the system you made copies on running same?
    >
    > Allison


    Allison...

    I used 22disk under DOS to format and the disk for the Kaypro DSDD and
    copy the files from pc to disk. I had downloaded a zipped copy of the
    Kaypro 2X operating system and other programs from
    http://www.retroarchive.org/cpm/os/os.htm. Just copying the files to
    disk apparently does not write the OS to disk. Any suggestions?

    Bob


  4. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    On 28 Jul 2006 04:27:21 -0700, "rmryan@wowway.com"
    wrote:

    >nospam@nouce.bellatlantic.net wrote:
    >> On 27 Jul 2006 10:03:28 -0700, "rmryan@wowway.com"
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >> >I recently purchased a Kaypro 2x, and need a boot disk. I have tried
    >> >using downloaded files, but this does not write the needed system files
    >> >to the disk. The ROM is 81-292A. Does any one have a disk available?

    >>
    >> More likely they were written on the wrong format drive. Kaypros used
    >> 48TPI drives, is the system you made copies on running same?
    >>
    >> Allison

    >
    >Allison...
    >
    >I used 22disk under DOS to format and the disk for the Kaypro DSDD and
    >copy the files from pc to disk. I had downloaded a zipped copy of the
    >Kaypro 2X operating system and other programs from
    >http://www.retroarchive.org/cpm/os/os.htm. Just copying the files to
    >disk apparently does not write the OS to disk. Any suggestions?
    >
    >Bob


    You can not copy the system tracks to the disk as a file. They are
    not in the file area of the media. You need a file image utility to
    copy the system tracks. There are image tools out there that should
    produce an entire disk from and "image".

    It up to others to suggest a DOS base tool. I use my CP/M based
    systems to produce disks I need. While I do have kaypros I do not
    have a 2x or the boot disk for that model.


    Allison

  5. System Disk Archive - was: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x


    >You can not copy the system tracks to the disk as a file. They are
    >not in the file area of the media. You need a file image utility to
    >copy the system tracks. There are image tools out there that should
    >produce an entire disk from and "image".


    >It up to others to suggest a DOS base tool. I use my CP/M based
    >systems to produce disks I need. While I do have kaypros I do not
    >have a 2x or the boot disk for that model.


    Neither do I ...

    An easy way to transfer most disks to/from images on the PC is with
    my ImageDisk program - it handles any format the PC hardware is
    capable of (which varies with PC to PC - with the right setup, single
    and mixed density disks are no problem).

    System disks are the lifeblood of vintage computers - without them
    they are just dead ornaments - I am attempting to build up a library
    of System Disks at:

    http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/img/index.htm

    The ImageDisk program is also available on this page - I would
    encourage anyone with vintage equipment to download the program,
    make images of the disks, and send them to me for inclusion in the
    archive. (I would very much like to have an image of the Kaypro 2X
    disk if/when it is found).

    I also encourage anyone and everyone to mirror the archive - I keep
    backups, but much of this material is irreplacable and multiple copies
    are the best way to prevent it from getting lost.

    Regards,
    Dave
    --
    dave06a@ Collector of classic pre-PC computer systems.
    dunfield. If you have an old 8/16 bit non-PC system in need of a good
    com home, please contact me at email address on the left, or
    via contact link of this web site:
    http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/index.html


  6. Re: System Disk Archive - was: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    Heya.

    Dave Dunfield wrote in message ...

    >I also encourage anyone and everyone to mirror the archive - I keep
    >backups, but much of this material is irreplacable and multiple copies
    >are the best way to prevent it from getting lost.


    That's a good idea; I have webspace to mirror your site, but have to look
    how to present it all.

    Greetz, Katzy.



  7. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    Hi Allison,

    It's been far too long but I'm sorta back. 8)

    Now to fill in some blanks for these newer folks...

    'dos,' *nix, and a few others have their operating system
    files in the Normal Sturcture of the disk, floppy or ridgid.
    The major difference between a Data and System disk for those
    is a./ a boot sector that has the basic info as to where those
    files are and for ridgig disks [hard disks] b./ an Active Flag
    in the Partition Table.

    CP/m has it ALL in defined tracks on the disk. [I *Know*
    that bootable hard disks somehow used a partition type of
    table... but Please Forgive me for I have Sinned by not
    booting my Xerox 821-II for ages][I Hope it still boots_whimper.]

    It gets More Exotic. Except for one or maybe two machines
    that had the Density_Select line hardwired to Double_Density,
    ALL track-00 ARE SINGLE DENSITY. The System Roms EXPECT this
    to be true.

    [IF I'm Wrong, please tell me and I'll try and remember.]

    This would Seem To Mean that it is Not Possible to write
    track-00 on any 'PC' type floppy controller.

    That does NOT include the ones sold as "CompatiCards" and ones
    like them. MOST of them could do that with their bundled
    software. The last one of them that I saw was for a PC/XT bus.

    Ok, to keep some of the stuff that I've forgotten to myself,
    I'll shut up for now.

    AR

    nospam@nouce.bellatlantic.net wrote:
    > On 28 Jul 2006 04:27:21 -0700, "rmryan@wowway.com"
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    >>nospam@nouce.bellatlantic.net wrote:
    >>
    >>>On 27 Jul 2006 10:03:28 -0700, "rmryan@wowway.com"
    >>> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>I recently purchased a Kaypro 2x, and need a boot disk. I have tried
    >>>>using downloaded files, but this does not write the needed system files
    >>>>to the disk. The ROM is 81-292A. Does any one have a disk available?
    >>>
    >>>More likely they were written on the wrong format drive. Kaypros used
    >>>48TPI drives, is the system you made copies on running same?
    >>>
    >>>Allison

    >>
    >>Allison...
    >>
    >>I used 22disk under DOS to format and the disk for the Kaypro DSDD and
    >>copy the files from pc to disk. I had downloaded a zipped copy of the
    >>Kaypro 2X operating system and other programs from
    >>http://www.retroarchive.org/cpm/os/os.htm. Just copying the files to
    >>disk apparently does not write the OS to disk. Any suggestions?
    >>
    >>Bob

    >
    >
    > You can not copy the system tracks to the disk as a file. They are
    > not in the file area of the media. You need a file image utility to
    > copy the system tracks. There are image tools out there that should
    > produce an entire disk from and "image".
    >
    > It up to others to suggest a DOS base tool. I use my CP/M based
    > systems to produce disks I need. While I do have kaypros I do not
    > have a 2x or the boot disk for that model.
    >
    >
    > Allison


  8. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    Hello, Alan!

    > It's been far too long but I'm sorta back. 8)
    >
    > Now to fill in some blanks for these newer folks...


    I have been wondering for some time who is the "Mark Ogden" who provided a
    source code of TEX (on "Gaby" Web site)?

    Is it you, or a relative?

    Yours Sincerely,
    "French Luser"




  9. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    >It gets More Exotic. Except for one or maybe two machines
    >that had the Density_Select line hardwired to Double_Density,
    >ALL track-00 ARE SINGLE DENSITY. The System Roms EXPECT this
    >to be true.


    >[IF I'm Wrong, please tell me and I'll try and remember.]


    >This would Seem To Mean that it is Not Possible to write
    >track-00 on any 'PC' type floppy controller.


    >That does NOT include the ones sold as "CompatiCards" and ones
    >like them. MOST of them could do that with their bundled
    >software. The last one of them that I saw was for a PC/XT bus.


    I've found many PCs which can write single density with the mainboard
    floppy controller - and lots more that can't. Suprisingly, a lot of the more
    recent boards are able to do it - annoyingly a lot of those provide hardware
    selects for only drive-A - but you can work around that.

    You just need to keep looking, you will find one. I have a utility called
    TESTSD which is a bootable floppy that will tell you if your controller
    can read/write single-density available on my images page:

    http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/img/index.htm

    Regards,

    --
    dave06a@ Collector of classic pre-PC computer systems.
    dunfield. If you have an old 8/16 bit non-PC system in need of a good
    com home, please contact me at email address on the left, or
    via contact link of this web site:
    http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/index.html


  10. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x


    "AR Ogden" wrote in message
    newsVCAg.10339$j9.5433@trnddc02...
    > Hi Allison,

    .... ...
    > It gets More Exotic. Except for one or maybe two machines
    > that had the Density_Select line hardwired to Double_Density,
    > ALL track-00 ARE SINGLE DENSITY. The System Roms EXPECT this
    > to be true.
    >
    > [IF I'm Wrong, please tell me and I'll try and remember.]
    >
    > This would Seem To Mean that it is Not Possible to write
    > track-00 on any 'PC' type floppy controller.
    >
    > That does NOT include the ones sold as "CompatiCards" and ones
    > like them. MOST of them could do that with their bundled software. The
    > last one of them that I saw was for a PC/XT bus.
    >
    > Ok, to keep some of the stuff that I've forgotten to myself,
    > I'll shut up for now.
    >
    > AR

    .......

    You are right that a need to write single density (on even
    1 track) can be a problem for 'PC's, but I don't think
    Kaypro's require that. I _have_ written a boot disk on
    my XT that worked in a Kaypro II, and I don't think the
    XT's (old) controller was rigged with a software or hardware
    density select capability (just MFM only). Look up my post
    from a few months back if you are interested in what was
    required. The key was to create a system image file for
    22disk to use.



  11. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    My branch of the Ogdens went south into 'cracker' country
    in Georgia and then off to Missouri. My grandfather
    and father were more into construction. Me, I was
    the 'black-sheep' of the family. I became a Building
    Inspector. 8) ... and general tech-weenie.

    So I have no idea if your Mark is related via any US branch
    of the family. Now back in Jolly Old England....

    AR




    French Luser wrote:
    > Hello, Alan!
    >
    >
    >>It's been far too long but I'm sorta back. 8)
    >>
    >>Now to fill in some blanks for these newer folks...

    >
    >
    > I have been wondering for some time who is the "Mark Ogden" who provided a
    > source code of TEX (on "Gaby" Web site)?
    >
    > Is it you, or a relative?
    >
    > Yours Sincerely,
    > "French Luser"
    >
    >
    >


  12. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    Fred J. Scipione wrote:
    > You are right that a need to write single density (on even
    > 1 track) can be a problem for 'PC's, but I don't think
    > Kaypro's require that. I _have_ written a boot disk on
    > my XT that worked in a Kaypro II, and I don't think the
    > XT's (old) controller was rigged with a software or hardware
    > density select capability (just MFM only). Look up my post
    > from a few months back if you are interested in what was
    > required. The key was to create a system image file for
    > 22disk to use.


    Good answer. All Kaypro's have MFM (double density) Floppy Disks used,
    and so all PC Floppy controller (upd765) are able to write this too.
    Only the first Osborne 1 (without the piggyback DD logic board) use
    single density format (FM, not MFM coded).
    All floppy controllers with WD chips (17xx and 27xx) should be able to
    write single density (FM) coded floppies, but PC compatibles don't have
    this controller by default.
    I've seen that someone had success with a Adaptec 1542 controller
    writing FM coded floppy disks... may be that is an option if needed.

    Regards
    Peter

  13. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    Hi,

    > I recently purchased a Kaypro 2x, and need a boot disk. I have tried
    > using downloaded files, but this does not write the needed system files
    > to the disk. The ROM is 81-292A. Does any one have a disk available?


    Just in case you didn't find the right image file yet - I got one for
    you.
    Please contact me at gaby@gaby.de

    Bye, Gaby

    --
    Mrs. Gaby Chaudry
    http://www.gaby.de
    mailto: gaby@gaby.de


  14. Re: Needed.....Boot disk for Kayro 2x

    Thanks, Gaby. Fortunately, a gentleman named John Reeve mailed me a
    hard copy of a Kaypro 2X boot disk. I was never able to find an actual
    disk image on the Net to download. I did receive advice on this and
    other forums about how to "create" a disk image, which I will do now
    that I have a disk to create it from. Any suggestions about where to
    post the image so that others may find it?


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