if i try to start it as ordinary user there are lots of error messages
(posted in earlier thread already) but seems to work fine as root.

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 03:23:07 +0100, NVangogh wrote:

> if i try to start it as ordinary user there are lots of error messages
> (posted in earlier thread already) but seems to work fine as root.

Because it needs to open, map and write to the graphics device, and for
whatever reason it's always been thought that that would be a bad thing
for unprivileged processes to be able to do. Large chunks of the X
server tends to blur the destinction between what you would expect to
find in a device driver and what should be in user space. You certainly
don't want something as large and gnarly as X to be part of the kernel,
but you do want it to be able to do some things that usually only kernel
things can. So it's a special case.

Often enough people come up with designs for abstractions and what-not
that would allow for a more traditional server/device split, and that
would probably allow the server to run untrusted, but historically those
sorts of things have made the server run slower, and hardly anyone likes
that.

--
Andrew

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 04:20:59 +0000, Andrew Reilly wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 03:23:07 +0100, NVangogh wrote:
>
>> if i try to start it as ordinary user there are lots of error messages
>> (posted in earlier thread already) but seems to work fine as root.
>
Ok - so how do i fix it so an normal user can run x?

NVangogh writes:

> if i try to start it as ordinary user there are lots of error messages
> (posted in earlier thread already) but seems to work fine as root.

Running at a raised securelevel?

Are you sure the messages you posted earlier are the ones you're
getting now?

--
Lowell Gilbert, embedded/networking software engineer
http://be-well.ilk.org/~lowell/

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 14:54:21 +0100
NVangogh wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 04:20:59 +0000, Andrew Reilly wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 03:23:07 +0100, NVangogh wrote:
> >
> >> if i try to start it as ordinary user there are lots of error messages
> >> (posted in earlier thread already) but seems to work fine as root.
> >
> Ok - so how do i fix it so an normal user can run x?

There are two options - one run xdm (or similar) from boot so that
X runs as root and xdm provides a graphical login - two make Xorg setuid
root (chmod +s /usr/local/bin/Xorg) and use startx.

--
C:>WIN | Directable Mirror Arrays
The computer obeys and wins. | A better way to focus the sun
You lose and Bill collects. | licences available see
| http://www.sohara.org/

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 16:15:03 +0100,
Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote:
> There are two options - one run xdm (or similar) from boot so that
> X runs as root and xdm provides a graphical login - two make Xorg setuid
> root (chmod +s /usr/local/bin/Xorg) and use startx.

Wasn't that what x11/wrapper was for?


--
j p d (at) d s b (dot) t u d e l f t (dot) n l .
This message was originally posted on Usenet in plain text.
Any other representation, additions, or changes do not have my
consent and may be a violation of international copyright law.

On 22 Aug 2008 19:37:19 GMT
jpd wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 16:15:03 +0100,
> Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote:
> > There are two options - one run xdm (or similar) from boot so
> > that X runs as root and xdm provides a graphical login - two make Xorg
> > setuid root (chmod +s /usr/local/bin/Xorg) and use startx.
>
> Wasn't that what x11/wrapper was for?

Yes that is indeed what it was for, I could have sworn it had gone
away with Xorg but it seems it hasn't.

To the OP - option three install x11/wrapper - preferable to
making Xorg setuid root.

--
C:>WIN | Directable Mirror Arrays
The computer obeys and wins. | A better way to focus the sun
You lose and Bill collects. | licences available see
| http://www.sohara.org/

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 14:54:21 +0100, NVangogh wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 04:20:59 +0000, Andrew Reilly wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 03:23:07 +0100, NVangogh wrote:
>>
>>> if i try to start it as ordinary user there are lots of error messages
>>> (posted in earlier thread already) but seems to work fine as root.
>>
> Ok - so how do i fix it so an normal user can run x?

Sorry, I'm a dunce. I didn't see your implied question, in the OP.

My advice: run xdm (by frobbing /etc/ttys) or (my current preference)
install and run gdm, which is the GNOME way. I'm pretty sure there's a
KDE way too, but I'm not familiar with it. Using gdm instead of xdm
means that you don't have to manually maintain an .xinitrc and other such
config/startup scripts. The downside is some slight opaqueness and
random magic, but that's a small price to pay. Starting it from the
command line (with startx) is for slackers who don't really want the GUI
experience, or who don't get the virtual terminal notion. :-)

Cheers,

--
Andrew

On Sat, 23 Aug 2008 09:52:14 UTC, Andrew Reilly
wrote:

> My advice: run xdm (by frobbing /etc/ttys) or (my current preference)
> install and run gdm, which is the GNOME way. I'm pretty sure there's a
> KDE way too, but I'm not familiar with it.

kdm!

--
Bob Eager
UNIX since v6..
http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h

> To the OP - option three install x11/wrapper - preferable to
> making Xorg setuid root.

I dont no what to do now cause i dont know what exactly you are advising
me to do. You told me to change the permissions for Xorg. I did 'chmod 777
Xorg'. This still does not make it work as a ordinary user and when i
started x it asked me to delete Xorg.conf.log - which i did. now the
system hangs whether i am root or a ordinary user.

How can i simply put it back to how it was before i typed what you advised?

thank you

On Sat, 23 Aug 2008 20:04:27 UTC, NVangogh
wrote:

>
> > To the OP - option three install x11/wrapper - preferable to
> > making Xorg setuid root.
>
> I dont no what to do now cause i dont know what exactly you are advising
> me to do. You told me to change the permissions for Xorg. I did 'chmod 777
> Xorg'.

Show us where you were told to type that. You weren't told to 'change
the permissions'.

> This still does not make it work as a ordinary user and when i
> started x it asked me to delete Xorg.conf.log - which i did. now the
> system hangs whether i am root or a ordinary user.

Don't know why it would ask that...are you sure you have that name
right?


--
Bob Eager
UNIX since v6..
http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h

On Sat, 23 Aug 2008 21:04:27 +0100
NVangogh wrote:

>
> > To the OP - option three install x11/wrapper - preferable to
> > making Xorg setuid root.
>
> I dont no what to do now cause i dont know what exactly you are advising
> me to do. You told me to change the permissions for Xorg. I did 'chmod 777
> Xorg'.

No I suggested making it setuid root - "chmod +s Xorg". I did *not*
suggest chmod 777 Xorg - that would be a bad thing to do.

> This still does not make it work as a ordinary user and when i
> started x it asked me to delete Xorg.conf.log - which i did. now the
> system hangs whether i am root or a ordinary user.

For starters put the permissions on Xorg back where they were
(chmod 555 Xorg seems likely). You may have lost your configuration - I
don't recall ever seeing an Xorg.conf.log but then I usually just take vi
to /etc/x11/xorg.conf to configure X.

> How can i simply put it back to how it was before i typed what you
> advised?

Go back and look at my post again, you did not do what I advised.
What you did do should be harmless enough though unless someone took
advantage of the relaxed permissions to modify your Xorg binary.

My revised suggestion (on learning the x11/wrapper is still around)
was to install that port.

--
C:>WIN | Directable Mirror Arrays
The computer obeys and wins. | A better way to focus the sun
You lose and Bill collects. | licences available see
| http://www.sohara.org/

On 23 Aug 2008 09:52:14 GMT
Andrew Reilly wrote:

> Starting it from the
> command line (with startx) is for slackers who don't really want the GUI
> experience, or who don't get the virtual terminal notion. :-)

Or who want to be able to boot their machine without starting X
sometimes, or who want to be able to start a second (or third or fourth) X
server sometimes.

--
C:>WIN | Directable Mirror Arrays
The computer obeys and wins. | A better way to focus the sun
You lose and Bill collects. | licences available see
| http://www.sohara.org/

On Sat, 23 Aug 2008 20:11:36 +0000, Bob Eager wrote:

>> > To the OP - option three install x11/wrapper - preferable to
>> > making Xorg setuid root.

I installed the wrapper & x starts as a normal user. But am not sure if it
is stable. It has cut out twice when i have opened a web browser and
caused a re-boot.

On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 20:31:21 UTC, NVangogh
wrote:

> On Sat, 23 Aug 2008 20:11:36 +0000, Bob Eager wrote:
>
> >> > To the OP - option three install x11/wrapper - preferable to
> >> > making Xorg setuid root.
>
> I installed the wrapper & x starts as a normal user. But am not sure if it
> is stable. It has cut out twice when i have opened a web browser and
> caused a re-boot.

Actually, I didn't write that - although I agree that it is a solution.
--
Bob Eager
UNIX since v6..
http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h