Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty) - BSD

This is a discussion on Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty) - BSD ; Hello all, The characters that should be available under third level shift (mapped to "Alt Gr" on my keyboard) cannot be typed when running X. In a ttyv they work just fine. I read through the keyboard and kbdcontrol man ...

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 27

Thread: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

  1. Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    Hello all,

    The characters that should be available under third level shift
    (mapped to "Alt Gr" on my keyboard) cannot be typed when running X.
    In a ttyv they work just fine.

    I read through the keyboard and kbdcontrol man pages a bit and came up
    with the following setup:

    In /etc/rc.conf I have included the line

    keymap="be.iso.acc"

    in order to load the be.iso.acc keymap on boot.

    The line that defines e.g. the key with &, 1 and | has the following
    entry in the be.iso.acc.kbd file:

    # scan cntrl alt alt cntrl lock
    # code base shift cntrl shift alt shift cntrl shift state
    # ------------------------------------------------------------------

    002 '&' '1' nop nop '|' '|' nop nop O

    Looks correct to me.

    When I check the key events with xev everything looks fine too; the
    "Alt Gr" key is read as ISO 3rd-level shift, and pressing e.g. "Alt Gr"
    and the "&" key is read out as the "|" character.

    I've also added the following in my .login_conf file

    me:\
    :charset=iso-8859-1:\
    :lang=en_US.ISO8859-1:

    to make sure I'm using the iso-8859-1 charset. Without this I cannot
    type characters such as and without using the compose key.

    That's all I can come up with for now. I googled my *ss off, but to no
    further avail.

    Is there anything else I'm missing?

    Thanks.

    --
    Mijnen deem, mijnen deem
    Stoeng heelmaal vol exeem
    ~ Katastroof

  2. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    In our last episode,
    ,
    the lovely and talented TomB
    broadcast on comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:

    > Hello all,


    > The characters that should be available under third level shift
    > (mapped to "Alt Gr" on my keyboard) cannot be typed when running X.
    > In a ttyv they work just fine.


    > I read through the keyboard and kbdcontrol man pages a bit and came up
    > with the following setup:


    > In /etc/rc.conf I have included the line


    > keymap="be.iso.acc"


    > in order to load the be.iso.acc keymap on boot.


    > The line that defines e.g. the key with &, 1 and | has the following
    > entry in the be.iso.acc.kbd file:


    > # scan cntrl alt alt cntrl lock
    > # code base shift cntrl shift alt shift cntrl shift state
    > # ------------------------------------------------------------------


    > 002 '&' '1' nop nop '|' '|' nop nop O


    > Looks correct to me.


    Yes. But these keymaps are in /usr/share/syscons, right? Well,
    that syscons is short for system console. Nothing you do here will
    affect the keyboard in X - not even login terminals which may
    seem in many respects like a tty, but are not.

    > When I check the key events with xev everything looks fine too; the
    > "Alt Gr" key is read as ISO 3rd-level shift, and pressing e.g. "Alt Gr"
    > and the "&" key is read out as the "|" character.


    > I've also added the following in my .login_conf file


    > me:\
    > :charset=iso-8859-1:\
    > :lang=en_US.ISO8859-1:


    > to make sure I'm using the iso-8859-1 charset. Without this I cannot
    > type characters such as and without using the compose key.


    > That's all I can come up with for now. I googled my *ss off, but to no
    > further avail.


    > Is there anything else I'm missing?


    Yes. None of the above has anything to do with X.

    X is not really a part of the BSD system. X is completely different
    in order that it be more-or-less the same whether it runs on one
    of the BSD flavors, Linux, or another sort-of-unix-like system.

    You need to be looking at xmodmap.

    --
    Lars Eighner SAVE BEASTIE! "What do you do when you're debranded?"
    usenet@larseighner.com http://larseighner.com/
    Scott Adams is an optimist.

  3. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:30:12 +0000, Lars Eighner wrote:

    > In our last episode,
    > ,
    > the lovely and talented TomB
    > broadcast on comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:
    >
    >> Hello all,

    >
    >> The characters that should be available under third level shift
    >> (mapped to "Alt Gr" on my keyboard) cannot be typed when running X.
    >> In a ttyv they work just fine.

    >
    >> I read through the keyboard and kbdcontrol man pages a bit and came up
    >> with the following setup:

    >
    >> In /etc/rc.conf I have included the line

    >
    >> keymap="be.iso.acc"

    >
    >> in order to load the be.iso.acc keymap on boot.

    >
    >> The line that defines e.g. the key with &, 1 and | has the following
    >> entry in the be.iso.acc.kbd file:

    >
    >> # scan cntrl alt alt cntrl lock
    >> # code base shift cntrl shift alt shift cntrl shift state
    >> # ------------------------------------------------------------------

    >
    >> 002 '&' '1' nop nop '|' '|' nop nop O

    >
    >> Looks correct to me.

    >
    > Yes. But these keymaps are in /usr/share/syscons, right? Well,
    > that syscons is short for system console. Nothing you do here will
    > affect the keyboard in X - not even login terminals which may
    > seem in many respects like a tty, but are not.
    >
    >> When I check the key events with xev everything looks fine too; the
    >> "Alt Gr" key is read as ISO 3rd-level shift, and pressing e.g. "Alt Gr"
    >> and the "&" key is read out as the "|" character.

    >
    >> I've also added the following in my .login_conf file

    >
    >> me:\
    >> :charset=iso-8859-1:\
    >> :lang=en_US.ISO8859-1:

    >
    >> to make sure I'm using the iso-8859-1 charset. Without this I cannot
    >> type characters such as and without using the compose key.

    >
    >> That's all I can come up with for now. I googled my *ss off, but to no
    >> further avail.

    >
    >> Is there anything else I'm missing?

    >
    > Yes. None of the above has anything to do with X.
    >
    > X is not really a part of the BSD system. X is completely different
    > in order that it be more-or-less the same whether it runs on one
    > of the BSD flavors, Linux, or another sort-of-unix-like system.


    Well, I normally use Debian, in which I define the keyboard layout for X
    in the keyboard section of xorg.conf, such as

    Section "InputDevice"
    Identifier "Keyboard"
    Driver "kbd"
    Option "XkbModel" "pc105"
    Option "XkbRules" "xorg"
    Option "XkbLayout" "be"
    EndSection

    I did the same for FreeBSD, and it does set the Belgian layout, but
    without the accented characters such as and , and the 3rd level shift
    characters such as | and #. The accented chars issue was fixed by adding
    the lines I described earlier to .login_conf (so it *does* affect X in a
    way), but I still can't get the 3rd level shift ones in X.

    > You need to be looking at xmodmap


    I do use xmodmap to remap some keys, but according to xev (which checks
    for X events) the correct characters *are* generated, so there's no need
    to remap them. Basically xev is the only program that gets e.g. an "@"
    when "Alt Gr" "" is pressed.

    Anything else I can look at?


  4. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    In our last episode, , the lovely
    and talented TomB broadcast on comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:

    > I do use xmodmap to remap some keys, but according to xev (which checks
    > for X events) the correct characters *are* generated, so there's no need
    > to remap them. Basically xev is the only program that gets e.g. an "@"
    > when "Alt Gr" "" is pressed.


    > Anything else I can look at?


    Look at the application. Some seem to access the keyboard at a lower level.

    Also, this seems a little obvious: prepare a few lines in the application,
    save it, and open it in a binary editor or a text editor that will tell you
    the character codes. The application may actually be getting the correct
    characters in the document, but you do not see them correctly because the
    application is using a wrong font.

    --
    Lars Eighner SAVE BEASTIE! "What do you do when you're debranded?"
    usenet@larseighner.com http://larseighner.com/
    TIP: To tweak a port or read the distribution information before you make,
    use #make extract to unpack the distribution file.

  5. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On 2008-08-20, TomB wrote:
    > On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:30:12 +0000, Lars Eighner wrote:


    >> You need to be looking at xmodmap

    >
    > I do use xmodmap to remap some keys, but according to xev (which checks
    > for X events) the correct characters *are* generated, so there's no need
    > to remap them. Basically xev is the only program that gets e.g. an "@"
    > when "Alt Gr" "" is pressed.


    Using xmodmap was where it went wrong. I call it from my .xinitrc, and
    when I comment it out and log in to X again, the 3rd level shift chars
    work fine. Calling xmodmap manually from a terminal at that point sets
    my desired keyswapping, *without* breaking the 3rd level shift chars.

    Can anyone shed a light on this one?

    --
    Attempted murder, now honestly, what is that? Do they give a
    Nobel Prize for attempted chemistry?
    ~ Sideshow Bob

  6. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    In our last episode,
    <4E_qk.155857$bi3.33565@newsfe11.ams2>,
    the lovely and talented TomB
    broadcast on comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:

    > On 2008-08-20, TomB wrote:
    >> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:30:12 +0000, Lars Eighner wrote:


    >>> You need to be looking at xmodmap

    >>
    >> I do use xmodmap to remap some keys, but according to xev (which checks
    >> for X events) the correct characters *are* generated, so there's no need
    >> to remap them. Basically xev is the only program that gets e.g. an "@"
    >> when "Alt Gr" "" is pressed.


    > Using xmodmap was where it went wrong. I call it from my .xinitrc, and
    > when I comment it out and log in to X again, the 3rd level shift chars
    > work fine. Calling xmodmap manually from a terminal at that point sets
    > my desired keyswapping, *without* breaking the 3rd level shift chars.


    > Can anyone shed a light on this one?


    Hmm, I never did it from .xinit. I load xmodmap from the window manager.
    Perhaps the window manager is stomping on xmodmap. Configuration for
    the window managers varies greatly, but there is usually a hook for
    stuff to do on startup. In fvwm2 it looks like this:

    DestroyFunc InitFunction
    AddToFunc InitFunction
    + I Module FvwmBanner
    + I exec xphoon
    + I exec xmodmap .xmodmap-debranded.6dollardialup.com
    + I exec xmodmap -e "keysym Num_Lock = Num_Lock Pointer_EnableKeys"
    + I exec xclipboard


    --
    Lars Eighner SAVE BEASTIE! "What do you do when you're debranded?"
    usenet@larseighner.com http://larseighner.com/
    chown -R us:us yourbase/*

  7. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    TomB wrote:
    > The characters that should be available under third level shift (mapped to
    > "Alt Gr" on my keyboard) cannot be typed when running X. In a ttyv they
    > work just fine.


    Note that your keyboard is broken. Get a real one.

    > I read through the keyboard and kbdcontrol man pages a bit and came up with
    > the following setup:


    kdbcontrol changes syscons, not X11. You need to look at setxkbmap.

    > In /etc/rc.conf I have included the line
    > keymap="be.iso.acc"
    > in order to load the be.iso.acc keymap on boot.


    This will work only for syscons.

    > Is there anything else I'm missing?


    Other than a normal keyboard, you probably need to configure the "correct"
    keymap in xorg.conf. Probably with a XkbRules entry. See the "be" rules file
    in /usr/local/share/X11/Xkb/rules/be, for instance.

    Alternatively, you may need to find out what keycode this mysterious "Alt Gr"
    key sends and use xmodmap to make it a 'third level shift'.

    - Philip

    --
    Philip Paeps Please don't email any replies
    philip@paeps.cx I follow the newsgroup.

    you know your career is long and gone when a google search for
    your name brings up a geocities site as the first result
    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=jason+donovan

  8. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:16:55 UTC, Philip Paeps
    wrote:

    > Alternatively, you may need to find out what keycode this mysterious "Alt Gr"
    > key sends and use xmodmap to make it a 'third level shift'.


    I don't quite understand why it's 'mysterious' to you, although if
    you've led a sheltered US-centric life you may not have seen one...it's
    the right hand Alt key.

    The scan code is the two byte sequence E0 38 (with E0 B8 when released).
    Hope this helps the OP.

    --
    Bob Eager
    UNIX since v6..
    http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h


  9. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    Bob Eager wrote:
    > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:16:55 UTC, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > > Alternatively, you may need to find out what keycode this mysterious "Alt
    > > Gr" key sends and use xmodmap to make it a 'third level shift'.

    >
    > I don't quite understand why it's 'mysterious' to you, although if you've
    > led a sheltered US-centric life you may not have seen one...it's the right
    > hand Alt key.


    It may surprise you that I am in fact Belgian.

    > The scan code is the two byte sequence E0 38 (with E0 B8 when released).
    > Hope this helps the OP.


    There we go. The OP just needs to map that to 'third level shift' and stuff
    should work.

    - Philip

    --
    Philip Paeps Please don't email any replies
    philip@paeps.cx I follow the newsgroup.

    [in #compsoc]
    woah... hold on guys... we're in danger of getting far too much
    done in one day

  10. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:45:46 UTC, Philip Paeps
    wrote:

    > Bob Eager wrote:
    > > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:16:55 UTC, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > > > Alternatively, you may need to find out what keycode this mysterious "Alt
    > > > Gr" key sends and use xmodmap to make it a 'third level shift'.

    > >
    > > I don't quite understand why it's 'mysterious' to you, although if you've
    > > led a sheltered US-centric life you may not have seen one...it's the right
    > > hand Alt key.

    >
    > It may surprise you that I am in fact Belgian.


    The Belgian PC keyboard has an AltGr key, so it's rather mysterious that
    you call it mysterious!

    --
    Bob Eager
    UNIX since v6..
    http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h


  11. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On 2008-08-24, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > TomB wrote:
    >> The characters that should be available under third level shift (mapped to
    >> "Alt Gr" on my keyboard) cannot be typed when running X. In a ttyv they
    >> work just fine.

    >
    > Note that your keyboard is broken. Get a real one.


    Hh, always on the mission.

    It's still on the todo list. Unfortunately the nice people at The
    Linux Emporium fail to reply to my mails. Makes one wonder why they
    bother putting an email address on their site.

    When was that trip to Japan of yours? :-)

    >> I read through the keyboard and kbdcontrol man pages a bit and came up with
    >> the following setup:

    >
    > kdbcontrol changes syscons, not X11. You need to look at setxkbmap.
    >
    >> In /etc/rc.conf I have included the line
    >> keymap="be.iso.acc"
    >> in order to load the be.iso.acc keymap on boot.

    >
    > This will work only for syscons.


    Yes. Still glad I've ventured there though. I now finally know how to
    configure the keyboard outside of X.

    >> Is there anything else I'm missing?

    >
    > Other than a normal keyboard, you probably need to configure the "correct"
    > keymap in xorg.conf. Probably with a XkbRules entry. See the "be" rules file
    > in /usr/local/share/X11/Xkb/rules/be, for instance.


    Yes, this was the first thing I did. See my other posts in this
    thread.

    > Alternatively, you may need to find out what keycode this mysterious "Alt Gr"
    > key sends and use xmodmap to make it a 'third level shift'.


    This was all correct, as indicated by xev. See my other posts in this thread.
    As I've already said: the misbehaviour of my - already broken ;-) - keyboard
    was caused by the fact that xmodmap was ran from .xinitrc. I still don't
    understand why.

    > - Philip
    >


    --
    tommy@mordor:~$ telnet mordor
    telnet: could not resolve mordor/telnet: One does not simply telnet
    into mordor!

  12. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    Bob Eager wrote:
    > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:45:46 UTC, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > > Bob Eager wrote:
    > > > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:16:55 UTC, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > > > > Alternatively, you may need to find out what keycode this mysterious
    > > > > "Alt Gr" key sends and use xmodmap to make it a 'third level shift'.
    > > >
    > > > I don't quite understand why it's 'mysterious' to you, although if
    > > > you've led a sheltered US-centric life you may not have seen one...it's
    > > > the right hand Alt key.

    > >
    > > It may surprise you that I am in fact Belgian.

    >
    > The Belgian PC keyboard has an AltGr key, so it's rather mysterious that you
    > call it mysterious!


    I've always resisted Belgian keyboards as cruel and unusual. :-)
    I use a happy hacking keyboard with a Unix-qwerty layout.

    - Philip

    --
    Philip Paeps Please don't email any replies
    philip@paeps.cx I follow the newsgroup.

    BOFH Excuse #324:
    Your packets were eaten by the terminator

  13. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 14:40:36 UTC, TomB
    wrote:

    > On 2008-08-24, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > > TomB wrote:
    > >> The characters that should be available under third level shift (mapped to
    > >> "Alt Gr" on my keyboard) cannot be typed when running X. In a ttyv they
    > >> work just fine.

    > >
    > > Note that your keyboard is broken. Get a real one.

    >
    > Hèhè, always on the mission.


    What's he trying to say, Tom? That a 'real' keyboard won't have AltGr
    because it won't be a Windows keyboard? Is he another Linux zealot?

    --
    Bob Eager
    UNIX since v6..
    http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h


  14. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 19:18:24 UTC, Philip Paeps
    wrote:

    > Bob Eager wrote:
    > > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:45:46 UTC, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > > > Bob Eager wrote:
    > > > > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:16:55 UTC, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > > > > > Alternatively, you may need to find out what keycode this mysterious
    > > > > > "Alt Gr" key sends and use xmodmap to make it a 'third level shift'.
    > > > >
    > > > > I don't quite understand why it's 'mysterious' to you, although if
    > > > > you've led a sheltered US-centric life you may not have seen one...it's
    > > > > the right hand Alt key.
    > > >
    > > > It may surprise you that I am in fact Belgian.

    > >
    > > The Belgian PC keyboard has an AltGr key, so it's rather mysterious that you
    > > call it mysterious!

    >
    > I've always resisted Belgian keyboards as cruel and unusual. :-)
    > I use a happy hacking keyboard with a Unix-qwerty layout.


    How do you define a UNIX [1] keyboard? One from a Sun workstation? If
    it's a QWERTY one, on a PC, then either it's a US one or I would expect
    it to have AltGr.

    [1] Not 'Unix'
    --
    Bob Eager
    UNIX since v6..
    http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h


  15. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    Bob Eager wrote:
    > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 19:18:24 UTC, Philip Paeps
    > wrote:
    >
    >> Bob Eager wrote:
    >> > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:45:46 UTC, Philip Paeps wrote:
    >> > > Bob Eager wrote:
    >> > > > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:16:55 UTC, Philip Paeps wrote:
    >> > > > > Alternatively, you may need to find out what keycode this mysterious
    >> > > > > "Alt Gr" key sends and use xmodmap to make it a 'third level shift'.
    >> > > >
    >> > > > I don't quite understand why it's 'mysterious' to you, although if
    >> > > > you've led a sheltered US-centric life you may not have seen one...it's
    >> > > > the right hand Alt key.
    >> > >
    >> > > It may surprise you that I am in fact Belgian.
    >> >
    >> > The Belgian PC keyboard has an AltGr key, so it's rather mysterious that you
    >> > call it mysterious!

    >>
    >> I've always resisted Belgian keyboards as cruel and unusual. :-)
    >> I use a happy hacking keyboard with a Unix-qwerty layout.

    >
    > How do you define a UNIX [1] keyboard? One from a Sun workstation? If
    > it's a QWERTY one, on a PC, then either it's a US one or I would expect
    > it to have AltGr.
    >
    > [1] Not 'Unix'


    Something with the "control" key where it belongs - next to the "a". The Sun
    Type 5 remains my canonical reference for a "good" keyboard. I'm aware it's
    got an "alt gr" key. I file that key under "mysterious" together with all the
    other keys on the type5 that have no clear use - like most of the left side of
    the keyboard. Though, "stop" of course has it's uses on Sun machines.

    I like happy hacking keyboards because they've got the 'important bits' of the
    type5 and places them where they belong. I do map the right "alt", which is
    where the "compose" key would go on a type5 to "compose" though.

    Pretty much the only real problem with type5 keyboards is that they don't make
    desks large enough for them. The happy hacking keyboard solves that problem.

    - Philip

    --
    Philip Paeps Please don't email any replies
    philip@paeps.cx I follow the newsgroup.

    fox: they're the ones who've been doing FORTRAN since 1967
    azz: please don't use the F word on #cs

  16. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    Bob Eager wrote:
    > On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 14:40:36 UTC, TomB
    > wrote:
    >
    >> On 2008-08-24, Philip Paeps wrote:
    >> > TomB wrote:
    >> >> The characters that should be available under third level shift (mapped to
    >> >> "Alt Gr" on my keyboard) cannot be typed when running X. In a ttyv they
    >> >> work just fine.
    >> >
    >> > Note that your keyboard is broken. Get a real one.

    >>
    >> Hèhè, always on the mission.

    >
    > What's he trying to say, Tom? That a 'real' keyboard won't have AltGr
    > because it won't be a Windows keyboard? Is he another Linux zealot?


    My criticism of the Belgian keyboard layout is world-famous on the Belgian
    parts of Usenet. :-)

    And I wouldn't consider myself a Linux zealot. Sadly, Linux-work accounts for
    a significant portion of my income together with real-time systems, but
    FreeBSD is my kernel of choice. It's also the one I hack on in my so-called
    spare time.

    - Philip

    --
    Philip Paeps Please don't email any replies
    philip@paeps.cx I follow the newsgroup.

    "I cut myself on a spoon."
    "How?"
    "It was a very sharp spoon."
    -- TRiPpy

  17. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    Begin
    On 24 Aug 2008 20:31:47 GMT, Philip Paeps wrote:
    >
    > My criticism of the Belgian keyboard layout is world-famous on the
    > Belgian parts of Usenet. :-)


    Ah, perhaps you could try a Dutch layout sometime. *runs away very quickly*


    --
    j p d (at) d s b (dot) t u d e l f t (dot) n l .
    This message was originally posted on Usenet in plain text.
    Any other representation, additions, or changes do not have my
    consent and may be a violation of international copyright law.

  18. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 20:31:47 UTC, Philip Paeps
    wrote:

    > And I wouldn't consider myself a Linux zealot. Sadly, Linux-work accounts for
    > a significant portion of my income together with real-time systems, but
    > FreeBSD is my kernel of choice. It's also the one I hack on in my so-called
    > spare time.


    That's good to hear. Been using BSD for 31 years here!

    --
    Bob Eager
    UNIX since v6..
    http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h


  19. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 20:28:03 UTC, Philip Paeps
    wrote:

    > > How do you define a UNIX [1] keyboard? One from a Sun workstation? If
    > > it's a QWERTY one, on a PC, then either it's a US one or I would expect
    > > it to have AltGr.
    > >
    > > [1] Not 'Unix'

    >
    > Something with the "control" key where it belongs - next to the "a". The Sun
    > Type 5 remains my canonical reference for a "good" keyboard. I'm aware it's
    > got an "alt gr" key. I file that key under "mysterious" together with all the
    > other keys on the type5 that have no clear use


    AltGr on an IBM keyboard selects additional characters - not many on my
    UK variant, mind. This is a real 102-key IBM keyboard which I've been
    using for 16 years daily (the same physical keyboard). The control key
    is not where you say, though.

    It too is a fairly large keyboard, particularly in depth...but somewhere
    to keep pens. It also provides a ledge wide enough for my cat to cross
    in front of the screen!
    --
    Bob Eager
    UNIX since v6..
    http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h


  20. Re: Third level shift characters do not work (Belgian azerty)

    On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 20:42:47 UTC, jpd
    wrote:

    > Begin
    > On 24 Aug 2008 20:31:47 GMT, Philip Paeps wrote:
    > >
    > > My criticism of the Belgian keyboard layout is world-famous on the
    > > Belgian parts of Usenet. :-)

    >
    > Ah, perhaps you could try a Dutch layout sometime. *runs away very quickly*


    LOL!

    --
    Bob Eager
    UNIX since v6..
    http://tinyurl.com/2xqr6h


+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast